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Distortion / Harmonics, etc.
Distortion / Harmonics, etc.
I have no idea where this* has been "plagiarized" from, I was rooting
around on an old PC and pulled it over on a flash drive to this one.
The information is interesting to the extent that the biggest thing
tubes have going for them to guitar players and listeners aurally, is
the oft-discussed "even-ordered harmonics" that tubes enable, when
pushed to saturation through levels of distortion.
Over the years, MOSFET technology and circuit design has taken great
leaps to mimic this sound / tone. Some great stomp boxes have come out
that don't utilize a pre-amp tube, like the Fulltone Full Drive II and
GT-500 (utilizing a wah inductor). I understand that Dave Moore, a
regular contributor to AGA has been working on his own production and
as time marches forward, boxes with and without a tube will continue to
proliferate. There's so many marketing and production variables between
the inventor and the consumer's ear, but in the end, you decide what you
like best and the next guy decides what he likes best. It's great
there's no "right" *WAY*.
Regards,
mvm
http :// tinyurl,com /32j32m
---------------------------------------
* ON HARMONICS
As applied to DISTORTION…
Analog? vs. Digital?
Musically the second is an octave above the fundamental and is almost
inaudible; yet it adds body to the sound, making it fuller.
The third is termed a quint or musical twelfth. It produces a sound many
musicians refer to as "blanketed." Instead of making the tone fuller, a
strong third actually makes the tone softer.
Adding a fifth to a strong third gives the sound a metallic quality that
gets annoying in character as its amplitude increases.
A strong second with a strong third tends to open the "covered" effect.
Adding the fourth and the fifth to this changes the sound to an "open
horn" like character.
The higher harmonics, above the seventh, give the tone "edge" or "bite.
Provided the edge is balanced to the basic musical tone, it tends to
reinforce the fundamental, giving the sound a sharp attack quality. Many
of the edge harmonics are musically unrelated pitches such as the
seventh, ninth, and eleventh. ***Therefore, too much edge can produce a
raspy dissonant quality***.
Since the ear seems very sensitive to the edge harmonics, controlling
their amplitude is of paramount importance. The previously mentioned
study of the trumpet tone shows that the edge effect is directly related
to the loudness of the tone. Playing the same trumpet note loud or soft
makes little difference in the amplitude of the fundamental and the
lower harmonics. However, harmonics above the sixth increase and
decrease in amplitude in a1most direct proportion to the loudness. This
edge balance is a critically important loudness signal for the human ear."
I have no idea where this* has been "plagiarized" from, I was rooting
around on an old PC and pulled it over on a flash drive to this one.
The information is interesting to the extent that the biggest thing
tubes have going for them to guitar players and listeners aurally, is
the oft-discussed "even-ordered harmonics" that tubes enable, when
pushed to saturation through levels of distortion.
Over the years, MOSFET technology and circuit design has taken great
leaps to mimic this sound / tone. Some great stomp boxes have come out
that don't utilize a pre-amp tube, like the Fulltone Full Drive II and
GT-500 (utilizing a wah inductor). I understand that Dave Moore, a
regular contributor to AGA has been working on his own production and
as time marches forward, boxes with and without a tube will continue to
proliferate. There's so many marketing and production variables between
the inventor and the consumer's ear, but in the end, you decide what you
like best and the next guy decides what he likes best. It's great
there's no "right" *WAY*.
Regards,
mvm
http :// tinyurl,com /32j32m
---------------------------------------
* ON HARMONICS
As applied to DISTORTION…
Analog? vs. Digital?
Musically the second is an octave above the fundamental and is almost
inaudible; yet it adds body to the sound, making it fuller.
The third is termed a quint or musical twelfth. It produces a sound many
musicians refer to as "blanketed." Instead of making the tone fuller, a
strong third actually makes the tone softer.
Adding a fifth to a strong third gives the sound a metallic quality that
gets annoying in character as its amplitude increases.
A strong second with a strong third tends to open the "covered" effect.
Adding the fourth and the fifth to this changes the sound to an "open
horn" like character.
The higher harmonics, above the seventh, give the tone "edge" or "bite.
Provided the edge is balanced to the basic musical tone, it tends to
reinforce the fundamental, giving the sound a sharp attack quality. Many
of the edge harmonics are musically unrelated pitches such as the
seventh, ninth, and eleventh. ***Therefore, too much edge can produce a
raspy dissonant quality***.
Since the ear seems very sensitive to the edge harmonics, controlling
their amplitude is of paramount importance. The previously mentioned
study of the trumpet tone shows that the edge effect is directly related
to the loudness of the tone. Playing the same trumpet note loud or soft
makes little difference in the amplitude of the fundamental and the
lower harmonics. However, harmonics above the sixth increase and
decrease in amplitude in a1most direct proportion to the loudness. This
edge balance is a critically important loudness signal for the human ear."
Re: Distortion / Harmonics, etc.
The text is from Russell O. Hamm’s famous paper “Tubes Vs. Transistors
– Is There An Audible Difference”. You should know that the author
drew the conclusions about harmonic characteristics of tubes and
transistors after measuring only four mic preamps. It's not what I'd
call a very comprehensive or universal test. On top of that, all
measured SS preamps were push-pull whereas all measured tube preamps
were SE. Those topologies alone assure that the harmonic patterns are
very different. As a general rule, push-pull stages cancel even order
harmonics. Also, judging by the figures presented in the paper, at
least one of the SS circuits Hamm tested seemed to be unstable and
oscillated at the onset of clipping. This introduces plenty of high-
order harmonics.
Properly designed transistor circuits can introduce even order
harmonics just as well as tube ones (e.g. just introduce some signal
asymmetry), similarly plenty of tube circuits introduce a lot of those
odd order harmonics.
The text is from Russell O. Hamm’s famous paper “Tubes Vs. Transistors
– Is There An Audible Difference”. You should know that the author
drew the conclusions about harmonic characteristics of tubes and
transistors after measuring only four mic preamps. It's not what I'd
call a very comprehensive or universal test. On top of that, all
measured SS preamps were push-pull whereas all measured tube preamps
were SE. Those topologies alone assure that the harmonic patterns are
very different. As a general rule, push-pull stages cancel even order
harmonics. Also, judging by the figures presented in the paper, at
least one of the SS circuits Hamm tested seemed to be unstable and
oscillated at the onset of clipping. This introduces plenty of high-
order harmonics.
Properly designed transistor circuits can introduce even order
harmonics just as well as tube ones (e.g. just introduce some signal
asymmetry), similarly plenty of tube circuits introduce a lot of those
odd order harmonics.
Re: Distortion / Harmonics, etc.
teemukyttala@gmail,com wrote:
> The text is from Russell O. Hamm’s famous paper “Tubes Vs. Transistors
> – Is There An Audible Difference”. You should know that the author
> drew the conclusions about harmonic characteristics of tubes and
> transistors after measuring only four mic preamps. It's not what I'd
> call a very comprehensive or universal test. On top of that, all
> measured SS preamps were push-pull whereas all measured tube preamps
> were SE. Those topologies alone assure that the harmonic patterns are
> very different. As a general rule, push-pull stages cancel even order
> harmonics. Also, judging by the figures presented in the paper, at
> least one of the SS circuits Hamm tested seemed to be unstable and
> oscillated at the onset of clipping. This introduces plenty of high-
> order harmonics.
>
> Properly designed transistor circuits can introduce even order
> harmonics just as well as tube ones (e.g. just introduce some signal
> asymmetry), similarly plenty of tube circuits introduce a lot of those
> odd order harmonics.
Thank you! That's not only impressive background positioning, it's
positive information worth sharing and I appreciate it. Cool. mvm
teemukyttala@gmail,com wrote:
> The text is from Russell O. Hamm’s famous paper “Tubes Vs. Transistors
> – Is There An Audible Difference”. You should know that the author
> drew the conclusions about harmonic characteristics of tubes and
> transistors after measuring only four mic preamps. It's not what I'd
> call a very comprehensive or universal test. On top of that, all
> measured SS preamps were push-pull whereas all measured tube preamps
> were SE. Those topologies alone assure that the harmonic patterns are
> very different. As a general rule, push-pull stages cancel even order
> harmonics. Also, judging by the figures presented in the paper, at
> least one of the SS circuits Hamm tested seemed to be unstable and
> oscillated at the onset of clipping. This introduces plenty of high-
> order harmonics.
>
> Properly designed transistor circuits can introduce even order
> harmonics just as well as tube ones (e.g. just introduce some signal
> asymmetry), similarly plenty of tube circuits introduce a lot of those
> odd order harmonics.
Thank you! That's not only impressive background positioning, it's
positive information worth sharing and I appreciate it. Cool. mvm
Re: Distortion / Harmonics, etc.
On May 4, 5:53 pm, Truth~Seeker <"fixing-44182"@.REMOVAL~mypacks,net >
wrote:
> teemukytt...@gmail,com wrote:
> > The text is from Russell O. Hamm’s famous paper “Tubes Vs. Transistors
> > – Is There An Audible Difference”. You should know that the author
> > drew the conclusions about harmonic characteristics of tubes and
> > transistors after measuring only four mic preamps. It's not what I'd
> > call a very comprehensive or universal test. On top of that, all
> > measured SS preamps were push-pull whereas all measured tube preamps
> > were SE. Those topologies alone assure that the harmonic patterns are
> > very different. As a general rule, push-pull stages cancel even order
> > harmonics. Also, judging by the figures presented in the paper, at
> > least one of the SS circuits Hamm tested seemed to be unstable and
> > oscillated at the onset of clipping. This introduces plenty of high-
> > order harmonics.
>
> > Properly designed transistor circuits can introduce even order
> > harmonics just as well as tube ones (e.g. just introduce some signal
> > asymmetry), similarly plenty of tube circuits introduce a lot of those
> > odd order harmonics.
>
> Thank you! That's not only impressive background positioning, it's
> positive information worth sharing and I appreciate it. Cool. mvm- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
Hey Doofus - why didn't you attribute the author of the article? It
was easy enough to do, but you chose to omit it.
And as teemukytt...@gmail,com points out, it's a flawed article. You
had no way of knowing though because of your nearly nonexistent
knowledge of electronics and acoustics. Not too different from your
newsgroup spews about other things you're clueless about, like modes,
music theory, guitar playing, electronics, etc.
On May 4, 5:53 pm, Truth~Seeker <"fixing-44182"@.REMOVAL~mypacks,net >
wrote:
> teemukytt...@gmail,com wrote:
> > The text is from Russell O. Hamm’s famous paper “Tubes Vs. Transistors
> > – Is There An Audible Difference”. You should know that the author
> > drew the conclusions about harmonic characteristics of tubes and
> > transistors after measuring only four mic preamps. It's not what I'd
> > call a very comprehensive or universal test. On top of that, all
> > measured SS preamps were push-pull whereas all measured tube preamps
> > were SE. Those topologies alone assure that the harmonic patterns are
> > very different. As a general rule, push-pull stages cancel even order
> > harmonics. Also, judging by the figures presented in the paper, at
> > least one of the SS circuits Hamm tested seemed to be unstable and
> > oscillated at the onset of clipping. This introduces plenty of high-
> > order harmonics.
>
> > Properly designed transistor circuits can introduce even order
> > harmonics just as well as tube ones (e.g. just introduce some signal
> > asymmetry), similarly plenty of tube circuits introduce a lot of those
> > odd order harmonics.
>
> Thank you! That's not only impressive background positioning, it's
> positive information worth sharing and I appreciate it. Cool. mvm- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
Hey Doofus - why didn't you attribute the author of the article? It
was easy enough to do, but you chose to omit it.
And as teemukytt...@gmail,com points out, it's a flawed article. You
had no way of knowing though because of your nearly nonexistent
knowledge of electronics and acoustics. Not too different from your
newsgroup spews about other things you're clueless about, like modes,
music theory, guitar playing, electronics, etc.
Re: Distortion / Harmonics, etc.
All this very much rings a bell on what I read about this DOD 'tubeFX'
weird-green distortion stompbox. It claimed to yield a 'tubey' sound
by introducing exactly the kind of harmonics mentioned. I suppose they
had even quoted the same text.
Thing was, the pedals was indeed very tubey, but worked well only
with certain amps and uses. When I played it in front of tube rigs,
the sound was nothing special at all. BUT when I stuck it in front of
a clean SS Boss Cube practice amp, I nearly fell off the chair.
Because the thing created such amazing lead wails with that amp it was
totally uncanny. Feedback-kinda howl and harmonic heaven. The pedal
was sold for 20 euros, and when I tested it with the boss, two store
employers came to listen and they were totally like what the fxxk, how
does that thing sound so damned good? They could not believe it and
wanted to try it themselves, and then remarked it shoulda had triple
the price tag at least. So I bought it...but sold later. I don't have
any SS amps myself these days, and while it did give a nice wail
addition to my Tech-21 D/I gear as well, I thought I don't need it.
But if I see one again relatively cheap, I'll get me one. If you have
a cube or similar, those are well worth a try.
So indeed they had achieved something of the 'tube essence' with the
introduction of those extra harmonics.
Cheers,
Dee
All this very much rings a bell on what I read about this DOD 'tubeFX'
weird-green distortion stompbox. It claimed to yield a 'tubey' sound
by introducing exactly the kind of harmonics mentioned. I suppose they
had even quoted the same text.
Thing was, the pedals was indeed very tubey, but worked well only
with certain amps and uses. When I played it in front of tube rigs,
the sound was nothing special at all. BUT when I stuck it in front of
a clean SS Boss Cube practice amp, I nearly fell off the chair.
Because the thing created such amazing lead wails with that amp it was
totally uncanny. Feedback-kinda howl and harmonic heaven. The pedal
was sold for 20 euros, and when I tested it with the boss, two store
employers came to listen and they were totally like what the fxxk, how
does that thing sound so damned good? They could not believe it and
wanted to try it themselves, and then remarked it shoulda had triple
the price tag at least. So I bought it...but sold later. I don't have
any SS amps myself these days, and while it did give a nice wail
addition to my Tech-21 D/I gear as well, I thought I don't need it.
But if I see one again relatively cheap, I'll get me one. If you have
a cube or similar, those are well worth a try.
So indeed they had achieved something of the 'tube essence' with the
introduction of those extra harmonics.
Cheers,
Dee
Re: Distortion / Harmonics, etc.
On May 4, 1:16 pm, Truth~Seeker <"fixing-44182"@.REMOVAL~mypacks,net >
wrote:
> I have no idea where this* has been "plagiarized" from ...
Indeed, today that is a hard research problem. But one day, there will
arise a global, inter-connected, network of computers that will be
used as the basis of a system for creating an inter-connected web of
pages and other documents. This massive volume of documents will be
actively indexed by programs known as search engines. You will be able
to type a few words of the text (surrounded by quotes to indicate an
exact phrase match) and the search engine will find documents which
contain that text!
On May 4, 1:16 pm, Truth~Seeker <"fixing-44182"@.REMOVAL~mypacks,net >
wrote:
> I have no idea where this* has been "plagiarized" from ...
Indeed, today that is a hard research problem. But one day, there will
arise a global, inter-connected, network of computers that will be
used as the basis of a system for creating an inter-connected web of
pages and other documents. This massive volume of documents will be
actively indexed by programs known as search engines. You will be able
to type a few words of the text (surrounded by quotes to indicate an
exact phrase match) and the search engine will find documents which
contain that text!
Re: Distortion / Harmonics, etc.
Kaz Kylheku wrote:
> On May 4, 1:16 pm, Truth~Seeker <"fixing-44182"@.REMOVAL~mypacks,net >
> wrote:
>> I have no idea where this* has been "plagiarized" from ...
>
> Indeed, today that is a hard research problem. But one day, there will
> arise a global, inter-connected, network of computers that will be
> used as the basis of a system for creating an inter-connected web of
> pages and other documents. This massive volume of documents will be
> actively indexed by programs known as search engines. You will be able
> to type a few words of the text (surrounded by quotes to indicate an
> exact phrase match) and the search engine will find documents which
> contain that text!
:-)...they should name it...GOOGLE! mvm
Kaz Kylheku wrote:
> On May 4, 1:16 pm, Truth~Seeker <"fixing-44182"@.REMOVAL~mypacks,net >
> wrote:
>> I have no idea where this* has been "plagiarized" from ...
>
> Indeed, today that is a hard research problem. But one day, there will
> arise a global, inter-connected, network of computers that will be
> used as the basis of a system for creating an inter-connected web of
> pages and other documents. This massive volume of documents will be
> actively indexed by programs known as search engines. You will be able
> to type a few words of the text (surrounded by quotes to indicate an
> exact phrase match) and the search engine will find documents which
> contain that text!
:-)...they should name it...GOOGLE! mvm
Re: Distortion / Harmonics, etc.
On May 5, 7:39 am, "Prof. <plonk>, CEO "
<"fixed-44182x"@.REMOVAL~my packs,net > wrote:
> Kaz Kylheku wrote:
> > On May 4, 1:16 pm, Truth~Seeker <"fixing-44182"@.REMOVAL~mypacks,net >
> > wrote:
> >> I have no idea where this* has been "plagiarized" from ...
>
> > Indeed, today that is a hard research problem. But one day, there will
> > arise a global, inter-connected, network of computers that will be
> > used as the basis of a system for creating an inter-connected web of
> > pages and other documents. This massive volume of documents will be
> > actively indexed by programs known as search engines. You will be able
> > to type a few words of the text (surrounded by quotes to indicate an
> > exact phrase match) and the search engine will find documents which
> > contain that text!
>
> :-)...they should name it...GOOGLE! mvm
Fell for that one, didn't ya?
Must be getting fatigued from all that typing!!!!
LOL
On May 5, 7:39 am, "Prof. <plonk>, CEO "
<"fixed-44182x"@.REMOVAL~my packs,net > wrote:
> Kaz Kylheku wrote:
> > On May 4, 1:16 pm, Truth~Seeker <"fixing-44182"@.REMOVAL~mypacks,net >
> > wrote:
> >> I have no idea where this* has been "plagiarized" from ...
>
> > Indeed, today that is a hard research problem. But one day, there will
> > arise a global, inter-connected, network of computers that will be
> > used as the basis of a system for creating an inter-connected web of
> > pages and other documents. This massive volume of documents will be
> > actively indexed by programs known as search engines. You will be able
> > to type a few words of the text (surrounded by quotes to indicate an
> > exact phrase match) and the search engine will find documents which
> > contain that text!
>
> :-)...they should name it...GOOGLE! mvm
Fell for that one, didn't ya?
Must be getting fatigued from all that typing!!!!
LOL
Re: Distortion / Harmonics, etc.
Kaz Kylheku wrote:
> On May 4, 1:16 pm, Truth~Seeker <"fixing-44182"@.REMOVAL~mypacks,net >
> wrote:
>> I have no idea where this* has been "plagiarized" from ...
>
> Indeed, today that is a hard research problem. But one day, there will
> arise a global, inter-connected, network of computers that will be
> used as the basis of a system for creating an inter-connected web of
> pages and other documents. This massive volume of documents will be
> actively indexed by programs known as search engines. You will be able
> to type a few words of the text (surrounded by quotes to indicate an
> exact phrase match) and the search engine will find documents which
> contain that text!
>
>
Mein GOOT Let's call eet... Das Google, yah? :-) mvm
Kaz Kylheku wrote:
> On May 4, 1:16 pm, Truth~Seeker <"fixing-44182"@.REMOVAL~mypacks,net >
> wrote:
>> I have no idea where this* has been "plagiarized" from ...
>
> Indeed, today that is a hard research problem. But one day, there will
> arise a global, inter-connected, network of computers that will be
> used as the basis of a system for creating an inter-connected web of
> pages and other documents. This massive volume of documents will be
> actively indexed by programs known as search engines. You will be able
> to type a few words of the text (surrounded by quotes to indicate an
> exact phrase match) and the search engine will find documents which
> contain that text!
>
>
Mein GOOT Let's call eet... Das Google, yah? :-) mvm
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