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kinda OT
kinda OT
Last night I was fiddling with scales on the piano. By accident I
played the notes C, D, E & F one at a time with my left hand & B, C, D
& E simultaneously with my right. I sounds good. I tried different
groups of notes like F, G, A, B & E, F, G, A but most all sounded like
shit. I'm wondering why C, D, E, F & B, C, D & E sound good together.
Is this a harmonic thing?
tgif,
tony
Last night I was fiddling with scales on the piano. By accident I
played the notes C, D, E & F one at a time with my left hand & B, C, D
& E simultaneously with my right. I sounds good. I tried different
groups of notes like F, G, A, B & E, F, G, A but most all sounded like
shit. I'm wondering why C, D, E, F & B, C, D & E sound good together.
Is this a harmonic thing?
tgif,
tony
Re: kinda OT
Yes, it is a harmonic thing.
You include every tone in the C major scale but the 5th, G.
In the other example, if you made the F's sharp, you would be playing
notes of the G major scale.
You could alter various notes sharp or flat, and get the tones from
other scales in that way.
Yes, it is a harmonic thing.
You include every tone in the C major scale but the 5th, G.
In the other example, if you made the F's sharp, you would be playing
notes of the G major scale.
You could alter various notes sharp or flat, and get the tones from
other scales in that way.
Re: kinda OT
On 4 Apr, 19:20, Derek <de...@ycoaoffice,com > wrote:
> Yes, it is a harmonic thing.
>
> You include every tone in the C major scale but the 5th, G.
And A.
But is that the explanation? His other example also includes notes of
the same scale but, he says, sounds crap by comparison.
On 4 Apr, 19:20, Derek <de...@ycoaoffice,com > wrote:
> Yes, it is a harmonic thing.
>
> You include every tone in the C major scale but the 5th, G.
And A.
But is that the explanation? His other example also includes notes of
the same scale but, he says, sounds crap by comparison.
Re: kinda OT
jimmy wrote:
> Last night I was fiddling with scales on the piano. By accident I
> played the notes C, D, E & F one at a time with my left hand & B, C, D
> & E simultaneously with my right. I sounds good. I tried different
> groups of notes like F, G, A, B & E, F, G, A but most all sounded like
> shit. I'm wondering why C, D, E, F & B, C, D & E sound good together.
> Is this a harmonic thing?
Harmony (harmonic) means two (or more) notes
sounded together, at the same time.
If you indeed play these notes at the same time
you are playing a "harmonic interval". If you played
them one after the other it would be a "melodic interval"
(melody is one note at a time).
Name the INTERVALS in your pairs of notes.
C B = Maj7
D C = ??
E D + ?? etc. Name the rest
F E
F E
G F
A G
B A
Now name what CHORDS each interval suggests.
ie, given your entire group of notes, A B C D E F and G,
and analyzing the first interval C to B (the M7 interval)
what CHORD does that C to B interval suggest?
Do that for each chord.
Lumpy
In Your Ears for 40 Years
www .LumpyMusic,com
jimmy wrote:
> Last night I was fiddling with scales on the piano. By accident I
> played the notes C, D, E & F one at a time with my left hand & B, C, D
> & E simultaneously with my right. I sounds good. I tried different
> groups of notes like F, G, A, B & E, F, G, A but most all sounded like
> shit. I'm wondering why C, D, E, F & B, C, D & E sound good together.
> Is this a harmonic thing?
Harmony (harmonic) means two (or more) notes
sounded together, at the same time.
If you indeed play these notes at the same time
you are playing a "harmonic interval". If you played
them one after the other it would be a "melodic interval"
(melody is one note at a time).
Name the INTERVALS in your pairs of notes.
C B = Maj7
D C = ??
E D + ?? etc. Name the rest
F E
F E
G F
A G
B A
Now name what CHORDS each interval suggests.
ie, given your entire group of notes, A B C D E F and G,
and analyzing the first interval C to B (the M7 interval)
what CHORD does that C to B interval suggest?
Do that for each chord.
Lumpy
In Your Ears for 40 Years
www .LumpyMusic,com
Re: kinda OT
johnty wrote:
>But is that the explanation? His other example also includes notes of
>the same scale but, he says, sounds crap by comparison.
Not quite. His first example contains C in both hands and no sharps
or flats. C is the only key without sharps or flats.
In his second example, C isn't present, but many of the notes from G
are. Since G just has one sharp (F#), just adding that one sharp
would make it sound fine.
johnty wrote:
>But is that the explanation? His other example also includes notes of
>the same scale but, he says, sounds crap by comparison.
Not quite. His first example contains C in both hands and no sharps
or flats. C is the only key without sharps or flats.
In his second example, C isn't present, but many of the notes from G
are. Since G just has one sharp (F#), just adding that one sharp
would make it sound fine.
Re: kinda OT
Lumpinator wrote:
>Harmony (harmonic) means two (or more) notes
>sounded together, at the same time.
You don't consider the relationship of notes played in succession, and
how they relate to each other harmony?
Lumpinator wrote:
>Harmony (harmonic) means two (or more) notes
>sounded together, at the same time.
You don't consider the relationship of notes played in succession, and
how they relate to each other harmony?
Re: kinda OT
Lumpinator wrote:
> > Harmony (harmonic) means two (or more) notes
> > sounded together, at the same time.
Derek:
> You don't consider the relationship
> of notes played in succession, and
> how they relate to each other harmony?
You do, but when they are played in succession
it's called a melodic interval rather than
a harmonic interval. The relationships don't
change (3rds, 5ths etc). It's simply a term.
The guitar is an odd animal because it's polyphonic.
When we (along with harps, keyboards) play one note
and then a 2nd note, you hear both a melodic AND
a harmonic interval. The closer together an arpeggio
gets, the more it is perceived as a harmonic interval.
The more you space out the arp, the more it's heard
as melodic. Technically ANY chord we play with a pick
or one finger is an arpeggio, even if we play it in
one very fast strum. The notes are falling a nanosecond
apart. We'd never perceive that as a melody, it sounds
to us like harmony.
Consider the difference in tension (it's all about tension)
between the two, melody and harmony.
Play a b5 interval harmonically (sounded simultaneously).
Then "clear your pallet" by playing some ii V I stuff.
Then play that same devil's interval as two separate
notes (melodic) as if you were a wind instrument that
is NOT able to play polyphonic.
Lumpy
In Your Ears for 40 Years
www .LumpyMusic,com
Lumpinator wrote:
> > Harmony (harmonic) means two (or more) notes
> > sounded together, at the same time.
Derek:
> You don't consider the relationship
> of notes played in succession, and
> how they relate to each other harmony?
You do, but when they are played in succession
it's called a melodic interval rather than
a harmonic interval. The relationships don't
change (3rds, 5ths etc). It's simply a term.
The guitar is an odd animal because it's polyphonic.
When we (along with harps, keyboards) play one note
and then a 2nd note, you hear both a melodic AND
a harmonic interval. The closer together an arpeggio
gets, the more it is perceived as a harmonic interval.
The more you space out the arp, the more it's heard
as melodic. Technically ANY chord we play with a pick
or one finger is an arpeggio, even if we play it in
one very fast strum. The notes are falling a nanosecond
apart. We'd never perceive that as a melody, it sounds
to us like harmony.
Consider the difference in tension (it's all about tension)
between the two, melody and harmony.
Play a b5 interval harmonically (sounded simultaneously).
Then "clear your pallet" by playing some ii V I stuff.
Then play that same devil's interval as two separate
notes (melodic) as if you were a wind instrument that
is NOT able to play polyphonic.
Lumpy
In Your Ears for 40 Years
www .LumpyMusic,com
Re: kinda OT
Derek wrote:
> Ok, sound logic.
It's music theory. Don't try and see logic in it.
Lumpy
In Your Ears for 40 Years
www .LumpyMusic,com
Derek wrote:
> Ok, sound logic.
It's music theory. Don't try and see logic in it.
Lumpy
In Your Ears for 40 Years
www .LumpyMusic,com
Re: kinda OT
Lumpy wrote:
> Play a b5 interval harmonically (sounded simultaneously).
That's the opening harmonic interval you
hear in Purple Haze. It's followed
by the same b5 [#4] interval, a b5th above that!
I don't know what key Jimi was in. Let's say Em
1st two notes (sounded together) are
A# and E. Go to hell!
2nd two notes start a b5 up from the E or
A# (again) paired with it's b5 (again) E.
A# E then A# E (8va)
Substitute the enharmonic spelling of A# if you like,
same results.
The #4/b5 interval, the one that sends us to
the eternal Dylan listening room if we play it,
is the exact center of an octave. 6 half steps
up or down from any note gives you it's
devil's interval.
The Aug4/dim5 and the octave/unison
are the only symmetrical intervals.
The most reposed interval (unison/octave) becomes
the most tense by cutting it in half.
"Eboneee and AhvoReee..."
Craig 'Lumpy' Lemke
Browne Horse Music
5526 E Pershing Ave
Scottsdale AZ 85254-3632
(480) 363-6095
--
In Your Ears for 40 Years
www .LumpyMusic,com
Lumpy wrote:
> Play a b5 interval harmonically (sounded simultaneously).
That's the opening harmonic interval you
hear in Purple Haze. It's followed
by the same b5 [#4] interval, a b5th above that!
I don't know what key Jimi was in. Let's say Em
1st two notes (sounded together) are
A# and E. Go to hell!
2nd two notes start a b5 up from the E or
A# (again) paired with it's b5 (again) E.
A# E then A# E (8va)
Substitute the enharmonic spelling of A# if you like,
same results.
The #4/b5 interval, the one that sends us to
the eternal Dylan listening room if we play it,
is the exact center of an octave. 6 half steps
up or down from any note gives you it's
devil's interval.
The Aug4/dim5 and the octave/unison
are the only symmetrical intervals.
The most reposed interval (unison/octave) becomes
the most tense by cutting it in half.
"Eboneee and AhvoReee..."
Craig 'Lumpy' Lemke
Browne Horse Music
5526 E Pershing Ave
Scottsdale AZ 85254-3632
(480) 363-6095
--
In Your Ears for 40 Years
www .LumpyMusic,com
Re: kinda OT
On Sat, 5 Apr 2008 06:17:54 -0700, "Lumpy"
<lumpy@digitalcartography,com > wrote:
>jimmy wrote:
>> Last night I was fiddling with scales on the piano. By accident I
>> played the notes C, D, E & F one at a time with my left hand & B, C, D
>> & E simultaneously with my right. I sounds good. I tried different
>> groups of notes like F, G, A, B & E, F, G, A but most all sounded like
>> shit. I'm wondering why C, D, E, F & B, C, D & E sound good together.
>> Is this a harmonic thing?
>
>Harmony (harmonic) means two (or more) notes
>sounded together, at the same time.
>
>If you indeed play these notes at the same time
>you are playing a "harmonic interval". If you played
>them one after the other it would be a "melodic interval"
>(melody is one note at a time).
>
>Name the INTERVALS in your pairs of notes.
>
I played this as harmonic intervals. Are they all Maj7 with 1st note
being root? Sounds too simple but that's what I come up with.
>C B = Maj7
>D C = ??
>E D + ?? etc. Name the rest
>F E
>
>F E
>G F
>A G
>B A
>
>Now name what CHORDS each interval suggests.
>ie, given your entire group of notes, A B C D E F and G,
>and analyzing the first interval C to B (the M7 interval)
>what CHORD does that C to B interval suggest?
>
>Do that for each chord.
>
>Lumpy
>
>In Your Ears for 40 Years
> www .LumpyMusic,com
>
>
On Sat, 5 Apr 2008 06:17:54 -0700, "Lumpy"
<lumpy@digitalcartography,com > wrote:
>jimmy wrote:
>> Last night I was fiddling with scales on the piano. By accident I
>> played the notes C, D, E & F one at a time with my left hand & B, C, D
>> & E simultaneously with my right. I sounds good. I tried different
>> groups of notes like F, G, A, B & E, F, G, A but most all sounded like
>> shit. I'm wondering why C, D, E, F & B, C, D & E sound good together.
>> Is this a harmonic thing?
>
>Harmony (harmonic) means two (or more) notes
>sounded together, at the same time.
>
>If you indeed play these notes at the same time
>you are playing a "harmonic interval". If you played
>them one after the other it would be a "melodic interval"
>(melody is one note at a time).
>
>Name the INTERVALS in your pairs of notes.
>
I played this as harmonic intervals. Are they all Maj7 with 1st note
being root? Sounds too simple but that's what I come up with.
>C B = Maj7
>D C = ??
>E D + ?? etc. Name the rest
>F E
>
>F E
>G F
>A G
>B A
>
>Now name what CHORDS each interval suggests.
>ie, given your entire group of notes, A B C D E F and G,
>and analyzing the first interval C to B (the M7 interval)
>what CHORD does that C to B interval suggest?
>
>Do that for each chord.
>
>Lumpy
>
>In Your Ears for 40 Years
> www .LumpyMusic,com
>
>
Re: kinda OT
jimmy wrote:
> I played this as harmonic intervals.
> Are they all Maj7 with 1st note
> being root? Sounds too simple
> but that's what I come up with.
>
> > C B = Maj7
> > D C = ??
> > E D + ?? etc. Name the rest
> > F E
> >
> > F E
> > G F
> > A G
> > B A
You tell me...
What's the definition of a Maj7 interval?
Apply that definition/formula to each of
the intervals you've found. Are they all
Maj7's?
"1st note being root" is probably an awkward
concept. An interval is the space between two
notes. There really is not a "root" in an interval.
We think of roots of a chord but that's because
we're defining a chord.
If we look at your first interval, it's a Maj7.
It's not a complete chord. But, if you play all
the other intervals you've named, then come back
to that C-B M7 interval, it suggests a CMaj7 chord.
There's a sonic trick going on. "If you play all the
other intervals named" is the trick. Can you see
what's happening?
You've played the notes
C D E F G A B
in various combinations.
So why does the C to B interval suggest a CM7 chord
and not something like a Bm7b9 or an Am9 or a D13,
all of which also contain a B and a C?
Lumpy
In Your Ears for 40 Years
www .LumpyMusic,com
jimmy wrote:
> I played this as harmonic intervals.
> Are they all Maj7 with 1st note
> being root? Sounds too simple
> but that's what I come up with.
>
> > C B = Maj7
> > D C = ??
> > E D + ?? etc. Name the rest
> > F E
> >
> > F E
> > G F
> > A G
> > B A
You tell me...
What's the definition of a Maj7 interval?
Apply that definition/formula to each of
the intervals you've found. Are they all
Maj7's?
"1st note being root" is probably an awkward
concept. An interval is the space between two
notes. There really is not a "root" in an interval.
We think of roots of a chord but that's because
we're defining a chord.
If we look at your first interval, it's a Maj7.
It's not a complete chord. But, if you play all
the other intervals you've named, then come back
to that C-B M7 interval, it suggests a CMaj7 chord.
There's a sonic trick going on. "If you play all the
other intervals named" is the trick. Can you see
what's happening?
You've played the notes
C D E F G A B
in various combinations.
So why does the C to B interval suggest a CM7 chord
and not something like a Bm7b9 or an Am9 or a D13,
all of which also contain a B and a C?
Lumpy
In Your Ears for 40 Years
www .LumpyMusic,com
Re: kinda OT
On Mon, 7 Apr 2008 08:25:15 -0700, "Lumpy"
<lumpy@digitalcartography,com > wrote:
>jimmy wrote:
>
>> I played this as harmonic intervals.
>> Are they all Maj7 with 1st note
>> being root? Sounds too simple
>> but that's what I come up with.
>>
>> > C B = Maj7
>> > D C = ??
>> > E D + ?? etc. Name the rest
>> > F E
>> >
>> > F E
>> > G F
>> > A G
>> > B A
>
>You tell me...
Using http :// www .musicdish,com /mag/index.php3?id=2078 as a reference
I'll try to answer.
>
>What's the definition of a Maj7 interval?
1st & 7th notes of the applicable scale.
>Apply that definition/formula to each of
>the intervals you've found. Are they all
>Maj7's?
Nope. The intervals D C & E D are both flattened 7ths so Dm7 & Em7.
>
>"1st note being root" is probably an awkward
>concept. An interval is the space between two
>notes. There really is not a "root" in an interval.
>We think of roots of a chord but that's because
>we're defining a chord.
>
>If we look at your first interval, it's a Maj7.
>It's not a complete chord. But, if you play all
>the other intervals you've named, then come back
>to that C-B M7 interval, it suggests a CMaj7 chord.
>
>There's a sonic trick going on. "If you play all the
>other intervals named" is the trick. Can you see
>what's happening?
Not sure about this part.
>
>You've played the notes
>C D E F G A B
>in various combinations.
>
>So why does the C to B interval suggest a CM7 chord
>and not something like a Bm7b9 or an Am9 or a D13,
>all of which also contain a B and a C?
Because the C Maj scale contains C D E F G A B.
>
>Lumpy
>
>In Your Ears for 40 Years
> www .LumpyMusic,com
On Mon, 7 Apr 2008 08:25:15 -0700, "Lumpy"
<lumpy@digitalcartography,com > wrote:
>jimmy wrote:
>
>> I played this as harmonic intervals.
>> Are they all Maj7 with 1st note
>> being root? Sounds too simple
>> but that's what I come up with.
>>
>> > C B = Maj7
>> > D C = ??
>> > E D + ?? etc. Name the rest
>> > F E
>> >
>> > F E
>> > G F
>> > A G
>> > B A
>
>You tell me...
Using http :// www .musicdish,com /mag/index.php3?id=2078 as a reference
I'll try to answer.
>
>What's the definition of a Maj7 interval?
1st & 7th notes of the applicable scale.
>Apply that definition/formula to each of
>the intervals you've found. Are they all
>Maj7's?
Nope. The intervals D C & E D are both flattened 7ths so Dm7 & Em7.
>
>"1st note being root" is probably an awkward
>concept. An interval is the space between two
>notes. There really is not a "root" in an interval.
>We think of roots of a chord but that's because
>we're defining a chord.
>
>If we look at your first interval, it's a Maj7.
>It's not a complete chord. But, if you play all
>the other intervals you've named, then come back
>to that C-B M7 interval, it suggests a CMaj7 chord.
>
>There's a sonic trick going on. "If you play all the
>other intervals named" is the trick. Can you see
>what's happening?
Not sure about this part.
>
>You've played the notes
>C D E F G A B
>in various combinations.
>
>So why does the C to B interval suggest a CM7 chord
>and not something like a Bm7b9 or an Am9 or a D13,
>all of which also contain a B and a C?
Because the C Maj scale contains C D E F G A B.
>
>Lumpy
>
>In Your Ears for 40 Years
> www .LumpyMusic,com
Re: kinda OT
jimmy wrote:
> C B = Maj7
> D C = ??
> E D + ?? etc. Name the rest
> F E
> G F
> A G
> B A
> > Are they all
> > Maj7's?
> Nope. The intervals D C & E D are both flattened 7ths so Dm7 & Em7.
> > So why does the C to B interval suggest a CM7 chord
> > and not something like a Bm7b9 or an Am9 or a D13,
> > all of which also contain a B and a C?
>
> Because the C Maj scale contains C D E F G A B.
Ok. Correct. Because it's the C Maj scale.
Now re-visit what you wrote above and use that
C Maj scale concept to explain -
Why does D C and E D suggest Dm7 and Em7?
Why don't they suggest D7 and E7?
Lumpy
In Your Ears for 40 Years
www .LumpyMusic,com
jimmy wrote:
> C B = Maj7
> D C = ??
> E D + ?? etc. Name the rest
> F E
> G F
> A G
> B A
> > Are they all
> > Maj7's?
> Nope. The intervals D C & E D are both flattened 7ths so Dm7 & Em7.
> > So why does the C to B interval suggest a CM7 chord
> > and not something like a Bm7b9 or an Am9 or a D13,
> > all of which also contain a B and a C?
>
> Because the C Maj scale contains C D E F G A B.
Ok. Correct. Because it's the C Maj scale.
Now re-visit what you wrote above and use that
C Maj scale concept to explain -
Why does D C and E D suggest Dm7 and Em7?
Why don't they suggest D7 and E7?
Lumpy
In Your Ears for 40 Years
www .LumpyMusic,com
Re: kinda OT
On Tue, 8 Apr 2008 07:09:56 -0700, "Lumpy"
<lumpy@digitalcartography,com > wrote:
>jimmy wrote:
>> C B = Maj7
>> D C = ??
>> E D + ?? etc. Name the rest
>> F E
>> G F
>> A G
>> B A
>
>> > Are they all
>> > Maj7's?
>
>> Nope. The intervals D C & E D are both flattened 7ths so Dm7 & Em7.
>
>> > So why does the C to B interval suggest a CM7 chord
>> > and not something like a Bm7b9 or an Am9 or a D13,
>> > all of which also contain a B and a C?
>>
>> Because the C Maj scale contains C D E F G A B.
>
>Ok. Correct. Because it's the C Maj scale.
>
>Now re-visit what you wrote above and use that
>C Maj scale concept to explain -
>
>Why does D C and E D suggest Dm7 and Em7?
>Why don't they suggest D7 and E7?
Hmmm, is it because D7 & E7 chords contain notes other than C D E F G
A B?
>Lumpy
>
>In Your Ears for 40 Years
> www .LumpyMusic,com
>
>
On Tue, 8 Apr 2008 07:09:56 -0700, "Lumpy"
<lumpy@digitalcartography,com > wrote:
>jimmy wrote:
>> C B = Maj7
>> D C = ??
>> E D + ?? etc. Name the rest
>> F E
>> G F
>> A G
>> B A
>
>> > Are they all
>> > Maj7's?
>
>> Nope. The intervals D C & E D are both flattened 7ths so Dm7 & Em7.
>
>> > So why does the C to B interval suggest a CM7 chord
>> > and not something like a Bm7b9 or an Am9 or a D13,
>> > all of which also contain a B and a C?
>>
>> Because the C Maj scale contains C D E F G A B.
>
>Ok. Correct. Because it's the C Maj scale.
>
>Now re-visit what you wrote above and use that
>C Maj scale concept to explain -
>
>Why does D C and E D suggest Dm7 and Em7?
>Why don't they suggest D7 and E7?
Hmmm, is it because D7 & E7 chords contain notes other than C D E F G
A B?
>Lumpy
>
>In Your Ears for 40 Years
> www .LumpyMusic,com
>
>
