Sweet Emotion

Re: Sweet Emotion

Crash Bandicoot wrote:
> jeffb wrote:
>> Crash Bandicoot wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Please stop spreading misinformation. There is no "C" natural or open
>>> strings in the opening riff.
>>
>> Relax dude, it's just a stupid rock song. "Misinformation" would be
>> something like "Hey kids, it's FINE to plug yer 120v power amp into a
>> 240v panel" when really it's not all that fine. I'm not saying Neil's
>> right and you're wrong..,fr ankly I couldn't care less about the exact
>> bass part on a 30 year old cover tune. I am saying it doesn't even
>> come close to mattering enough to call it "misinformation". If you
>> played what Neil's saying is the part during a bar gig (and where the
>> fuck else are you gonna play it?), right or wrong, nobody, and I mean
>> NOBODY would know the difference much less care. And you or any other
>> Arrowsmith bass scholars don't count as you will never buy enough beer
>> for your opinions to matter to a bar owner. That's the stone cold
>> reality of the bass line for Sweet Emotion.
>>
>> And all that said there's absolutely NOTHING wrong with getting the
>> exact line down..,it just doesn't matter much.
>>
>>
>
>
> When someone asks how to play something *properly* then the correct
> answer is the one that reflects what's on the recording.
> The OP did not ask, "How can I expand on this classic riff and make it
> my own?". If that were the question, then anything goes...
>
> Since the OP wants to play it as written, why debate what notes and
> positions comprise the bass line when the *author* of the part was
> diligent enough to explain *exactly* how he plays it?

My God, think of what could happen if people started playing it *WRONGGGG*.

<Cleavon Little voice>
Chill, baaaaybeh.
</cleavon>

--
Les Cargill

Re: Sweet Emotion

Crash Bandicoot wrote:

>
> When someone asks how to play something *properly* then the correct
> answer is the one that reflects what's on the recording.

You mean note for note? If that's what you mean then SAY note for note.
"Properly" doesn't mean anything and it makes you sound like an
arrogant, know-it-all jerk-off.

> The OP did not ask, "How can I expand on this classic riff and make it
> my own?". If that were the question, then anything goes...

Not talking about that although it's a very, very good thing to talk
about...certainly a much more interesting topic than what the "proper"
notes are for a fuckin cover tune. All I said to you and NOTHING else
was that the term "misinformation" is *way* too heavy handed for what
Neil said...the word implies a deliberate attempt to lead someone astray
and if that's what Neil was up to I've been misjudging him for a while
now. Have I been misjudging you Neil? Are you out to fuck over the
newbies by feeding them wrong notes?

> Since the OP wants to play it as written, why debate what notes and
> positions comprise the bass line when the *author* of the part was
> diligent enough to explain *exactly* how he plays it?

I wasn't debating that at all and I wasn't going to but since you ask
I'll tell you...actually no, I'll tell the OP since it's obvious your
mind is far too literal to be very flexible and that makes you extremely
uninteresting.

To the OP:
Since Gash Bandersnatch brought it up you should think about whether or
not you NEED to play this note for note to be convincing... and you have
to decide what exactly "convincing" means to you. I guarantee you can
play the exact notes but if you don't cop the feel and the "intent" it
still won't sound right. The point here is that after playing a lot of
covers over a lot of years I've always gone for intent over note for
note and not gotten complaints. It has nothing to do with "diligence"
and everything to do with musicality and how much time you want to spend
shedding covers. There are some tunes you DO need to cop the exact line
or it'll sound like a wank but the difference between a B and a C in
this particular tune is NOT one of those times.

Try this: work yer ass off on copping the feel of the line and play it
with a C and with a B without saying anything to yer band and see if
anyone notices. Please post the results.

Re: Sweet Emotion

jeffb wrote:
> Crash Bandicoot wrote:
>
>>
>> When someone asks how to play something *properly* then the correct
>> answer is the one that reflects what's on the recording.
>
> You mean note for note? If that's what you mean then SAY note for note.
> "Properly" doesn't mean anything and it makes you sound like an
> arrogant, know-it-all jerk-off.
>
>> The OP did not ask, "How can I expand on this classic riff and make it
>> my own?". If that were the question, then anything goes...
>
> Not talking about that although it's a very, very good thing to talk
> about...certainly a much more interesting topic than what the "proper"
> notes are for a fuckin cover tune. All I said to you and NOTHING else
> was that the term "misinformation" is *way* too heavy handed for what
> Neil said...the word implies a deliberate attempt to lead someone astray
> and if that's what Neil was up to I've been misjudging him for a while
> now. Have I been misjudging you Neil? Are you out to fuck over the
> newbies by feeding them wrong notes?
>
>> Since the OP wants to play it as written, why debate what notes and
>> positions comprise the bass line when the *author* of the part was
>> diligent enough to explain *exactly* how he plays it?
>
> I wasn't debating that at all and I wasn't going to but since you ask
> I'll tell you...actually no, I'll tell the OP since it's obvious your
> mind is far too literal to be very flexible and that makes you extremely
> uninteresting.
>
> To the OP:
> Since Gash Bandersnatch brought it up you should think about whether or
> not you NEED to play this note for note to be convincing... and you have
> to decide what exactly "convincing" means to you. I guarantee you can
> play the exact notes but if you don't cop the feel and the "intent" it
> still won't sound right. The point here is that after playing a lot of
> covers over a lot of years I've always gone for intent over note for
> note and not gotten complaints. It has nothing to do with "diligence"
> and everything to do with musicality and how much time you want to spend
> shedding covers. There are some tunes you DO need to cop the exact line
> or it'll sound like a wank but the difference between a B and a C in
> this particular tune is NOT one of those times.
>
> Try this: work yer ass off on copping the feel of the line and play it
> with a C and with a B without saying anything to yer band and see if
> anyone notices. Please post the results.
>

Time for the OP to weigh in. I wanted to see if anyone else plays this
note for note. I wanted to see how you, if you do play it note for note,
handle the cross string alternate plucking thing that I think he must be
doing. I find that little part of the passage particularly difficult. I
could play the whole thing an octave lower, use the open A, and voila,
it's a piece of cake. For the challenge I'd like to do it as per the tab
though. But then tonight we played it, I played it an octave lower
pretty damn well, and the only person that noticed anything at all was
me. So maybe screw the challenge, I'll just play it like that from now
on. I must admit being in a band that even does this song isn't my
favorite thing in life. But we are writing our own songs and starting to
incorporate more and more of those into our shows. I find that
infinitely more satisfying than playing 30+ year old covers. Be that as
it may, I find that passage difficult and I thank everyone for speaking
up, especially Susan who seems to do it pretty close to what I was
trying to do and advised doing string crossing exercises. I think that's
something we could all benefit from.

Re: Sweet Emotion

OscartheGrouch wrote:
> jeffb wrote:
>> Crash Bandicoot wrote:

<snip>

> Time for the OP to weigh in. I wanted to see if anyone else plays this
> note for note. I wanted to see how you, if you do play it note for note,
> handle the cross string alternate plucking thing that I think he must be
> doing. I find that little part of the passage particularly difficult. I
> could play the whole thing an octave lower, use the open A, and voila,
> it's a piece of cake. For the challenge I'd like to do it as per the tab
> though. But then tonight we played it, I played it an octave lower
> pretty damn well, and the only person that noticed anything at all was
> me. So maybe screw the challenge, I'll just play it like that from now
> on. I must admit being in a band that even does this song isn't my
> favorite thing in life. But we are writing our own songs and starting to
> incorporate more and more of those into our shows. I find that
> infinitely more satisfying than playing 30+ year old covers. Be that as
> it may, I find that passage difficult and I thank everyone for speaking
> up, especially Susan who seems to do it pretty close to what I was
> trying to do and advised doing string crossing exercises. I think that's
> something we could all benefit from.

Hi Oscar,

Glad to be of help! Especially since I'm usually needing help myself:-)

Your band sounds cool, good luck with the originals!

Cheers!

-Susan

Re: Sweet Emotion

jeffb wrote:
> Crash Bandicoot wrote:
>
>>
>> When someone asks how to play something *properly* then the correct
>> answer is the one that reflects what's on the recording.
>
> You mean note for note? If that's what you mean then SAY note for note.
> "Properly" doesn't mean anything and it makes you sound like an
> arrogant, know-it-all jerk-off.
>
>> The OP did not ask, "How can I expand on this classic riff and make it
>> my own?". If that were the question, then anything goes...
>
> Not talking about that although it's a very, very good thing to talk
> about...certainly a much more interesting topic than what the "proper"
> notes are for a fuckin cover tune. All I said to you and NOTHING else
> was that the term "misinformation" is *way* too heavy handed for what
> Neil said...the word implies a deliberate attempt to lead someone astray
> and if that's what Neil was up to I've been misjudging him for a while
> now. Have I been misjudging you Neil? Are you out to fuck over the
> newbies by feeding them wrong notes?
>
>> Since the OP wants to play it as written, why debate what notes and
>> positions comprise the bass line when the *author* of the part was
>> diligent enough to explain *exactly* how he plays it?
>
> I wasn't debating that at all and I wasn't going to but since you ask
> I'll tell you...actually no, I'll tell the OP since it's obvious your
> mind is far too literal to be very flexible and that makes you extremely
> uninteresting.
>
> To the OP:
> Since Gash Bandersnatch brought it up you should think about whether or
> not you NEED to play this note for note to be convincing... and you have
> to decide what exactly "convincing" means to you. I guarantee you can
> play the exact notes but if you don't cop the feel and the "intent" it
> still won't sound right. The point here is that after playing a lot of
> covers over a lot of years I've always gone for intent over note for
> note and not gotten complaints. It has nothing to do with "diligence"
> and everything to do with musicality and how much time you want to spend
> shedding covers. There are some tunes you DO need to cop the exact line
> or it'll sound like a wank but the difference between a B and a C in
> this particular tune is NOT one of those times.
>
> Try this: work yer ass off on copping the feel of the line and play it
> with a C and with a B without saying anything to yer band and see if
> anyone notices. Please post the results.
>



Ok, first of all, you need to calm down.
My original post was not intended to accuse "Neil" of some kind of JFK
conspiracy, only to stop him from sending the OP down the wrong trail.
The goal was to explain the way to play the original riff *as recorded
by Tom Hamilton*. There's a scene in "Waiting For Guffman" where
Christopher Guest argues that the actors have to forget what they've
learned. Then Bob Balaban argues, "How can you forget it if you've never
learned it?" Can you wrap your mind around that?

Neil was *clearly* off the mark with what he said, and in that sense,
*yes* -- it was misinformation. There is no "C" natural in the riff, and
the open "A" does NOT represent how Hamilton plays it, and it changes
the cadence of the part -- IMO for the worse. Even the OP admits this.
The song is a classic, as is the bassline. There's nothing more
embarrassing then some newbie doofus proudly showing off that they're
playing it totally wrong, but in their *mind* they're playing it right.

That is *totally* separate from re-inventing the song and making it your
own, which believe me, is something I am not incapable of doing (you
have no idea what my skill level is) so to accuse me of being
"inflexible and uninteresting" is meaningless because you've never heard
me play a note. I think you're more concerned with justifying your buddy
"Neil's" description of how to play the riff (incorrectly) when it is
not really what the OP wanted.

Re: Sweet Emotion

I think EQ magazine just interviewed Jay Messina, and he mentioned
overdubbing a bass marimba part on that song.