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Thoughts on gas prices
I am pretty tired of the whole gas is $4 and the sky is falling
hysteria.
I just bought a 20 oz Diet Pepsi for $1.25 from a machine at work.
That's $8 a gallon! And I'll usually drink 4 of those (sometimes more)
in a day. So I am spending around $5 a day on Pepsi. My drive to work
is 26 miles round trip. My car gets around 23 mpg making this trip, so
I am using about 1.13 gallons of gas. Even at $4, per gallon, that is
only around $4.52 per day.
So who should I get mad at - Exxon-Mobil, or PepsiCo? Or maybe
Time-Warner - I spend $100 on cable / internet a month. This is about
the same as I'll spend on gas for commuting to work in a month even
with gas at $4.
Or maybe the local movie theatres? $7.50 to see a movie??????????
Ed
hysteria.
I just bought a 20 oz Diet Pepsi for $1.25 from a machine at work.
That's $8 a gallon! And I'll usually drink 4 of those (sometimes more)
in a day. So I am spending around $5 a day on Pepsi. My drive to work
is 26 miles round trip. My car gets around 23 mpg making this trip, so
I am using about 1.13 gallons of gas. Even at $4, per gallon, that is
only around $4.52 per day.
So who should I get mad at - Exxon-Mobil, or PepsiCo? Or maybe
Time-Warner - I spend $100 on cable / internet a month. This is about
the same as I'll spend on gas for commuting to work in a month even
with gas at $4.
Or maybe the local movie theatres? $7.50 to see a movie??????????
Ed
"C. E. White" <cewhite3@removemindspring.com> wrote in message
news:482c366f$1@kcnews01...
>I am pretty tired of the whole gas is $4 and the sky is falling hysteria.
>
> I just bought a 20 oz Diet Pepsi for $1.25 from a machine at work. That's
> $8 a gallon! And I'll usually drink 4 of those (sometimes more) in a day.
> So I am spending around $5 a day on Pepsi. My drive to work is 26 miles
> round trip. My car gets around 23 mpg making this trip, so I am using
> about 1.13 gallons of gas. Even at $4, per gallon, that is only around
> $4.52 per day.
>
> So who should I get mad at - Exxon-Mobil, or PepsiCo? Or maybe
> Time-Warner - I spend $100 on cable / internet a month. This is about the
> same as I'll spend on gas for commuting to work in a month even with gas
> at $4.
>
> Or maybe the local movie theatres? $7.50 to see a movie??????????
>
> Ed
Ed - All consumer products (like groceries, for example) depend on cheap
energy to bring them to market. Your 20oz pepsi for example is $1.25. But
with gas (and diesel) hovering around the $4/gallon mark, you can expect
that to up to $1.75 or maybe $2.00 very soon. Then there is the $5 gallon
of milk (will happen) and the $4 loaf of bread (will happen) and so on.
Prices of everything go up, which leads to major job loss eventually. And
it's a snowball effect...
If you are comparing the price of a gallon of gasoline to soda or cable TV
service or movie tickets, you are simply missing the point.
On a side note, I'm not too upset about gas being $4/gallon. What upsets me
is that I don't see the price coming down anytime soon, and I expect it to
rise. This country (the U.S.) is probably going to skip right past
recession and straight into depression, as a result. It starts with
$4/gallon gasoline. We're there already. Nobody is arguing that we aren't
already in a recession. But I don't think it's going to stop at a
recession, unfortunately. -Dave
On 2008-05-15, Dave <noway@nohow.not> wrote:
> On a side note, I'm not too upset about gas being $4/gallon. What upsets me
> is that I don't see the price coming down anytime soon, and I expect it to
> rise. This country (the U.S.) is probably going to skip right past
> recession and straight into depression, as a result. It starts with
> $4/gallon gasoline. We're there already. Nobody is arguing that we aren't
> already in a recession. But I don't think it's going to stop at a
> recession, unfortunately. -Dave
$4/gallon gasoline is not the starting point. The starting point was the
federal reserve system coupled with US interventionist foreign
policy, interventionist domestic policy, and entitlement programs
domestically. That's where the inflation begins, the anti-competition
regulation, etc and so forth.
The run away spending of the government on wars and entitlements is
killing the dollar. The fed is blowing bubbles with all the money being
creating for the spending. The wars are causing traders to panic... it
just goes on and on. It's a big ball of idiotcy rooted in a monetary
policy that money can be created from nothing and the future will
pay for it all that is showing itself in high fuel prices.
> On a side note, I'm not too upset about gas being $4/gallon. What upsets me
> is that I don't see the price coming down anytime soon, and I expect it to
> rise. This country (the U.S.) is probably going to skip right past
> recession and straight into depression, as a result. It starts with
> $4/gallon gasoline. We're there already. Nobody is arguing that we aren't
> already in a recession. But I don't think it's going to stop at a
> recession, unfortunately. -Dave
$4/gallon gasoline is not the starting point. The starting point was the
federal reserve system coupled with US interventionist foreign
policy, interventionist domestic policy, and entitlement programs
domestically. That's where the inflation begins, the anti-competition
regulation, etc and so forth.
The run away spending of the government on wars and entitlements is
killing the dollar. The fed is blowing bubbles with all the money being
creating for the spending. The wars are causing traders to panic... it
just goes on and on. It's a big ball of idiotcy rooted in a monetary
policy that money can be created from nothing and the future will
pay for it all that is showing itself in high fuel prices.
Dave wrote:
> "C. E. White" <cewhite3@removemindspring.com> wrote
>
> >I am pretty tired of the whole gas is $4 and the sky is falling hysteria.
> >
> > I just bought a 20 oz Diet Pepsi for $1.25 from a machine at work. That's
> > $8 a gallon! And I'll usually drink 4 of those (sometimes more) in a day.
> > So I am spending around $5 a day on Pepsi. My drive to work is 26 miles
> > round trip. My car gets around 23 mpg making this trip, so I am using
> > about 1.13 gallons of gas. Even at $4, per gallon, that is only around
> > $4.52 per day.
> >
> > So who should I get mad at - Exxon-Mobil, or PepsiCo? Or maybe
> > Time-Warner - I spend $100 on cable / internet a month. This is about the
> > same as I'll spend on gas for commuting to work in a month even with gas
> > at $4.
> >
> > Or maybe the local movie theatres? $7.50 to see a movie??????????
>
>
> Ed - All consumer products (like groceries, for example) depend on cheap
> energy to bring them to market. Your 20oz pepsi for example is $1.25. But
> with gas (and diesel) hovering around the $4/gallon mark, you can expect
> that to up to $1.75 or maybe $2.00 very soon.
TOTAL RUBBISH.
My local supermarket offers a 2 litre bottle (that's a LOT more than 20 fl oz)
of their own brand cola for 20 British pence (that's about 40 cents).
Clearly your idea of the proportion of the price related to transport costs is
pure fantasy.
Graham
In article <4830307D.B7ABE5EE@hotmail.com>,
Eeyore <rabbitsfriendsandrelations@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>TOTAL RUBBISH.
>
>My local supermarket offers a 2 litre bottle (that's a LOT more than 20 fl oz)
We know them as 66.7 fl oz bottles. A quite common size.
--
There's no such thing as a free lunch, but certain accounting practices can
result in a fully-depreciated one.
Eeyore <rabbitsfriendsandrelations@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>TOTAL RUBBISH.
>
>My local supermarket offers a 2 litre bottle (that's a LOT more than 20 fl oz)
We know them as 66.7 fl oz bottles. A quite common size.
--
There's no such thing as a free lunch, but certain accounting practices can
result in a fully-depreciated one.
C. E. White wrote:
> I am pretty tired of the whole gas is $4 and the sky is falling hysteria.
>
> I just bought a 20 oz Diet Pepsi for $1.25 from a machine at work.
> That's $8 a gallon! And I'll usually drink 4 of those (sometimes more)
> in a day.
Perhaps you should consider buying a 2L bottle for the same price and
taking it to work with you. Four 20 oz bottles adds up to (591 mL * 4 =
2364 mL = 2.4L). Unlike gas, there is a somewhat cheaper alternative
for soft drinks compared to a vending machine.
In any case, I switched over from diet soft drinks to crystal light.
Three gallons of that costs a little less than $4, so it's still
_cheaper_ than gas ;)
> I am pretty tired of the whole gas is $4 and the sky is falling hysteria.
>
> I just bought a 20 oz Diet Pepsi for $1.25 from a machine at work.
> That's $8 a gallon! And I'll usually drink 4 of those (sometimes more)
> in a day.
Perhaps you should consider buying a 2L bottle for the same price and
taking it to work with you. Four 20 oz bottles adds up to (591 mL * 4 =
2364 mL = 2.4L). Unlike gas, there is a somewhat cheaper alternative
for soft drinks compared to a vending machine.
In any case, I switched over from diet soft drinks to crystal light.
Three gallons of that costs a little less than $4, so it's still
_cheaper_ than gas ;)
"Arif Khokar" <akhokar1234@wvu.edu> wrote in message
news:91%Wj.5606$Wq.3886@fe105.usenetserver.com...
> C. E. White wrote:
>
>> I am pretty tired of the whole gas is $4 and the sky is falling
>> hysteria.
>>
>> I just bought a 20 oz Diet Pepsi for $1.25 from a machine at work.
>> That's $8 a gallon! And I'll usually drink 4 of those (sometimes
>> more) in a day.
>
> Perhaps you should consider buying a 2L bottle for the same price
> and taking it to work with you. Four 20 oz bottles adds up to (591
> mL * 4 = 2364 mL = 2.4L). Unlike gas, there is a somewhat cheaper
> alternative for soft drinks compared to a vending machine.
Actually I have thought about this, but I like my drinks cold. In
general, I hate the taste of drinks out of 2 liter bottles. It seems
by the end of the bottle the fizz is all gone and the soda tastes
flat. I could get a mini refrigerator and buy drinks at Costco. I
don't particularly like 20 oz drinks in plastic, I prefer 12 oz drinks
in cans. They are about $0.25 each at Costco. I could easily pay for
the mini-frig in a few months from the savings, assuming I can find
room in the office and my office mate wouldn't want to fill up the
frig with his lunches. And then there is the matter of transporting
drinks from Costco to the office. It is all so inconvenient. Still the
question remains, should I be madder at Pepsi or Exxon-Mobil? I
already know that Pepsi sells their product for a fraction of the
price they are charging me at work just down the street. As far as I
can tell Exxon-Mobil isn't raking me over the coals like Pepsi. Pepsi
is obviously producing diet Pepsi for less than $0.02 per ounce (cost
at Costco for 12 ounce cans). Just for the service of delivering it to
me at work instead of at Costco, they are charging 200% more ($0.04
more, total of $0.06 per ounce). I don't think Exxon-Mobil is charging
me 200% more to move the gasoline from the distributor to my local
station (or even 200% to make a barrel of crude into gasoline and
delivering it). The point is, Exxon-Mobil is not making wildly
excessive profits like some would claim.
Pepsi also sells bottles water in the same machine at work, also for
$1.20. Turns out it is the same water you get from the tap at home
(they bottle it just down the road and it is just local tap water - I
assume filtered).
I just get tired of people saying "woe is me, those evil oil companies
are stealing my money, we must punish them." The best way to punish
the oil companies is to buy less gasoline. Everyone is quick to point
out that I could change my actions to reduce the amount of money I
spend on Diet Pepsi. Well, they should apply the same principal to
gasoline. Drive less, the next time they buy a car, get one that is
more fuel efficient, aggressively shop for the lowest price on fuel,
etc., etc., etc.
> In any case, I switched over from diet soft drinks to crystal light.
> Three gallons of that costs a little less than $4, so it's still
> _cheaper_ than gas ;)
ewww...
Ed
The flaw in this logic is that drinking soda pop at work is optional;
getting to work is not. And if it's the nature of your business that
you have to drive a lot -- or you just live a long way from the
nearest decent job -- it hurts.
Note also that people who are not well paid anyway catch it first and
worst. If the office managers and engineers and programmers and
whatnot are feeling the hurt, the janitors and day-care attendants
and so forth (not to mention old folks whose fixed incomes are
already under assault from many angles) are coming away from the gas
pump feeling like they just got mugged.
Lots of people out there who are already close enough to the margin
that there isn't much to cut back *on* -- people for whom $7.50 for a
movie, $100/month for cable modem, or frequent treats out of vending
machines would have been luxuries even before gas prices went up.
There are going to be a lot of lifestyle changes for all of us. I'm
reminded of John McPhee's book _Basin and Range_, one of his earth-
sciences excursions. One of the geologists with whom he hobnobs in
the book mentions a cross-country car trip and remarks that it might
soon be an index-fossil experience (this was in the early 80s, another
time of spiking oil prices). This was a mere aside in a story that
was not really about fuel resources, but it's worth noting that one of
the main figures in the narrative, Princeton professor Kenneth
Deffeyes, recently wrote some rather pertinent works:
http://www.princeton.edu/hubbert/
--Joe
getting to work is not. And if it's the nature of your business that
you have to drive a lot -- or you just live a long way from the
nearest decent job -- it hurts.
Note also that people who are not well paid anyway catch it first and
worst. If the office managers and engineers and programmers and
whatnot are feeling the hurt, the janitors and day-care attendants
and so forth (not to mention old folks whose fixed incomes are
already under assault from many angles) are coming away from the gas
pump feeling like they just got mugged.
Lots of people out there who are already close enough to the margin
that there isn't much to cut back *on* -- people for whom $7.50 for a
movie, $100/month for cable modem, or frequent treats out of vending
machines would have been luxuries even before gas prices went up.
There are going to be a lot of lifestyle changes for all of us. I'm
reminded of John McPhee's book _Basin and Range_, one of his earth-
sciences excursions. One of the geologists with whom he hobnobs in
the book mentions a cross-country car trip and remarks that it might
soon be an index-fossil experience (this was in the early 80s, another
time of spiking oil prices). This was a mere aside in a story that
was not really about fuel resources, but it's worth noting that one of
the main figures in the narrative, Princeton professor Kenneth
Deffeyes, recently wrote some rather pertinent works:
http://www.princeton.edu/hubbert/
--Joe
On 2008-05-16, Ad absurdum per aspera <jtchew@california.com> wrote:
> There are going to be a lot of lifestyle changes for all of us.
There will be poor and there will be wealthy and not much in between,
just like any other 3rd world kelptocracy/police state.
> http://www.princeton.edu/hubbert/
The world is awash with oil. There is no oil shortage. Massive
finds are still occuring, the most recent I know of is in Brazil and
it's huge. Sure, it isn't jed's shot gun crude but it's oil that will
last for centuries.
High fuel prices are the direct result with US government interference
in the market place on behalf of big oil and others, the federal
reserve banking cartel, and an interventionist foreign policy.
Take note that nations that have not been inflating their money have
seen a much lower increase in the price of oil. Only that which is
proportional with the supply instabilities caused by the US federal
government empire activities in oil producing regions. Also note, that
in real silver backed money, gasoline is still at 1960s prices. (35
cents in 90% silver coin is currently $4.20 in today's federal reserve
notes)
Given that the US federal government is full of people who see
themselves as central planners, I do expect there to be fuel and oil
shortages in the future. They will do something stupid as they did in
the 1970s and there will be gas lines, food lines, toilet paper lines.
It is the end result of all central planning of an economy. Ask anyone
who has lived in castro's cuba or the good old CCCP.
> There are going to be a lot of lifestyle changes for all of us.
There will be poor and there will be wealthy and not much in between,
just like any other 3rd world kelptocracy/police state.
> http://www.princeton.edu/hubbert/
The world is awash with oil. There is no oil shortage. Massive
finds are still occuring, the most recent I know of is in Brazil and
it's huge. Sure, it isn't jed's shot gun crude but it's oil that will
last for centuries.
High fuel prices are the direct result with US government interference
in the market place on behalf of big oil and others, the federal
reserve banking cartel, and an interventionist foreign policy.
Take note that nations that have not been inflating their money have
seen a much lower increase in the price of oil. Only that which is
proportional with the supply instabilities caused by the US federal
government empire activities in oil producing regions. Also note, that
in real silver backed money, gasoline is still at 1960s prices. (35
cents in 90% silver coin is currently $4.20 in today's federal reserve
notes)
Given that the US federal government is full of people who see
themselves as central planners, I do expect there to be fuel and oil
shortages in the future. They will do something stupid as they did in
the 1970s and there will be gas lines, food lines, toilet paper lines.
It is the end result of all central planning of an economy. Ask anyone
who has lived in castro's cuba or the good old CCCP.
On Thu, 15 May 2008 19:26:49 -0700 (PDT), Ad absurdum per aspera
<jtchew@california.com> wrote:
>The flaw in this logic is that drinking soda pop at work is optional;
>getting to work is not. And if it's the nature of your business that
>you have to drive a lot -- or you just live a long way from the
>nearest decent job -- it hurts.
If it hurts enough, you will a) take transit, b) carpool, c) move
closer, or d) get a new job closer to home.
Americans bitch and moan, but few of them know what REAL gas price
pain is.
>Note also that people who are not well paid anyway catch it first and
>worst.
Actually, anyone who fails to LIVE WITHIN THEIR MEANS is who feels it
first. The same is true with this sub-prime mortgage crisis: people
took on more lifestyle than they could afford, and wound up getting
bitten in the ass.
Anyone who is driving an SUV instead of a Yaris or a Smart and who is
complaining about gas prices needs to just STFU. Like right now.
--
"Dave's not here, man!"
- Tommy Chong
<jtchew@california.com> wrote:
>The flaw in this logic is that drinking soda pop at work is optional;
>getting to work is not. And if it's the nature of your business that
>you have to drive a lot -- or you just live a long way from the
>nearest decent job -- it hurts.
If it hurts enough, you will a) take transit, b) carpool, c) move
closer, or d) get a new job closer to home.
Americans bitch and moan, but few of them know what REAL gas price
pain is.
>Note also that people who are not well paid anyway catch it first and
>worst.
Actually, anyone who fails to LIVE WITHIN THEIR MEANS is who feels it
first. The same is true with this sub-prime mortgage crisis: people
took on more lifestyle than they could afford, and wound up getting
bitten in the ass.
Anyone who is driving an SUV instead of a Yaris or a Smart and who is
complaining about gas prices needs to just STFU. Like right now.
--
"Dave's not here, man!"
- Tommy Chong
On 2008-05-16, Scott in SoCal <scottenaztlan@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Anyone who is driving an SUV instead of a Yaris or a Smart and who is
> complaining about gas prices needs to just STFU. Like right now.
I'll continue to complain about all the negative effects of high gas
prices which annoy me far more than the high gas prices themselves. :)
> Anyone who is driving an SUV instead of a Yaris or a Smart and who is
> complaining about gas prices needs to just STFU. Like right now.
I'll continue to complain about all the negative effects of high gas
prices which annoy me far more than the high gas prices themselves. :)
In article
<ea863783-2aac-43db-96cd-3928ffa965db@p39g2000prm.googlegroups.com>,
Ad absurdum per aspera <jtchew@california.com> wrote:
> The flaw in this logic is that drinking soda pop at work is optional;
> getting to work is not.
Getting to work is not optional, but how you get to work typically
involves numerous choices, such as the type of vehicle you drive, how
close you live to work, choice of public or private transportation, car
pooling, moving closer to work, etc.
<ea863783-2aac-43db-96cd-3928ffa965db@p39g2000prm.googlegroups.com>,
Ad absurdum per aspera <jtchew@california.com> wrote:
> The flaw in this logic is that drinking soda pop at work is optional;
> getting to work is not.
Getting to work is not optional, but how you get to work typically
involves numerous choices, such as the type of vehicle you drive, how
close you live to work, choice of public or private transportation, car
pooling, moving closer to work, etc.
On Thu, 15 May 2008 09:09:54 -0400, "C. E. White"
<cewhite3@removemindspring.com> wrote:
>I am pretty tired of the whole gas is $4 and the sky is falling
>hysteria.
All I know is that high gas prices = less traffic on the roads (at
least in my neck of the woods). Sounds like a small premium to pay for
such improved driving conditions. Bring on the US$5.00 gas....
--
"That's interesting. I hadn't heard that. ..."
--George W. Bush on the prospect of US$4.00 gas
<cewhite3@removemindspring.com> wrote:
>I am pretty tired of the whole gas is $4 and the sky is falling
>hysteria.
All I know is that high gas prices = less traffic on the roads (at
least in my neck of the woods). Sounds like a small premium to pay for
such improved driving conditions. Bring on the US$5.00 gas....
--
"That's interesting. I hadn't heard that. ..."
--George W. Bush on the prospect of US$4.00 gas
On 2008-05-16, necromancer <55_sux@worldofnecromancer_no_spam_no_way.org> wrote:
> All I know is that high gas prices = less traffic on the roads (at
> least in my neck of the woods). Sounds like a small premium to pay for
> such improved driving conditions. Bring on the US$5.00 gas....
If that were true here.... sadly I think such a prediction will end up
in the dust bin along with my half-hope that the fearmongers who said
computer controlled cars would stop functioning on 01-01-00 would be
right... so me and everyone else who has pre-computer cars could have
the roads to ourselves ;)
Ever see that series 'jerchico'(sp?) seems they had most of the modern
cars knocked out with a nuke's EMP in the story line so most everyone
is driving around in anything with points ;)
> All I know is that high gas prices = less traffic on the roads (at
> least in my neck of the woods). Sounds like a small premium to pay for
> such improved driving conditions. Bring on the US$5.00 gas....
If that were true here.... sadly I think such a prediction will end up
in the dust bin along with my half-hope that the fearmongers who said
computer controlled cars would stop functioning on 01-01-00 would be
right... so me and everyone else who has pre-computer cars could have
the roads to ourselves ;)
Ever see that series 'jerchico'(sp?) seems they had most of the modern
cars knocked out with a nuke's EMP in the story line so most everyone
is driving around in anything with points ;)
On Fri, 16 May 2008 00:46:49 -0400, necromancer
<55_sux@worldofnecromancer_no_spam_no_way.org> wrote:
>On Thu, 15 May 2008 09:09:54 -0400, "C. E. White"
><cewhite3@removemindspring.com> wrote:
>
>>I am pretty tired of the whole gas is $4 and the sky is falling
>>hysteria.
>
>All I know is that high gas prices = less traffic on the roads (at
>least in my neck of the woods).
Unfortunately, there is no noticeable reduction in freeway traffic
around here. Every morning the NB 5 is still a parking lot.
--
"Dave's not here, man!"
- Tommy Chong
<55_sux@worldofnecromancer_no_spam_no_way.org> wrote:
>On Thu, 15 May 2008 09:09:54 -0400, "C. E. White"
><cewhite3@removemindspring.com> wrote:
>
>>I am pretty tired of the whole gas is $4 and the sky is falling
>>hysteria.
>
>All I know is that high gas prices = less traffic on the roads (at
>least in my neck of the woods).
Unfortunately, there is no noticeable reduction in freeway traffic
around here. Every morning the NB 5 is still a parking lot.
--
"Dave's not here, man!"
- Tommy Chong
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