Obscene pilot forces Northwest to cancel flight

Re: Obscene pilot forces Northwest to cancel flight


"Mxsmanic" <mxsmanic@gmail . com > wrote in message
news:v54m139ecn8lqr9cg1prm3lfovifeis7h9@4ax . com ...
>K Baum writes:
>
>> Something I would like to ad for clarification to others on this
>> thread is that drug testing is random. Alcohol testing isnt (Contrary
>> to what others have posted). A pilot can be ask to submit to an
>> alcohol screening only in certain curcumstances. Hope this helps.
>
> Why is alcohol treated differently? It's a drug like any other.
>

Probably because it's a LEGAL substance.

Re: Obscene pilot forces Northwest to cancel flight

Maxwell writes:

> Probably because it's a LEGAL substance.

Legal or not, it impairs pilots just as much as the illegal drugs, if not
more.

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.

Re: Obscene pilot forces Northwest to cancel flight


"Mxsmanic" <mxsmanic@gmail . com > wrote in message
news:a91n13lrap9e852t1gd6gfgs7j79b9bv9b@4ax . com ...
> Maxwell writes:
>
>> Probably because it's a LEGAL substance.
>
> Legal or not, it impairs pilots just as much as the illegal drugs, if not
> more.
>

As usual, right over your head.

Just for the record, how old are you, really?

Re: Obscene pilot forces Northwest to cancel flight

possumrex@yahoo . com wrote in
news:1176042663.281507.49580@b75g2000hsg.googlegroups . com :

> On Apr 7, 1:43 pm, "Dudley Henriques" <dhenriq...@rcn . com > wrote:
>> The real issue here isn't the language used by the pilot per se'. The
>> issue of importance is the pilot's emotional and mental state leading
>> up to a take off which the language indicated. This is why the FAA
>> got him off the flight and probably why, after the hearing, he will
>> no longer be employed by Northwest.
>> Frankly, its a good thing they discovered this. Whatever it was he
>> was involved with on that phone, it wasn't consistent with normal
>> flight safety procedures.
>> Dudley Henriques
>>
>> "Thank you for flying F_ck Air" <thank...@forflying.f-ck.air> wrote
>> in messagenews:apjf131bsdm6abatrdfsi8j0mh8d6864t7@news...
>>
>>
>>
>> > Flight canceled after pilot curses at passengers
>> > April 7, 2007
>>
>> > (CNN) -- Northwest Airlines canceled a flight with 180 passengers
>> > aboard after the pilot began cursing at passengers while the plane
>> > was being prepared for takeoff in Las Vegas on Friday, airline
>> > officials and witnesses said.
>>
>> > The cancellation disrupted Easter travel plans for many of the
>> > passengers.
>>
>> > From the moment the captain stepped aboard Flight 1190 to Detroit,
>> > first-class passengers reported hearing him use "animated" language
>> > while talking on his cell phone, Federal Aviation Administration
>> > spokesman Ian Gregor told CNN.
>>
>> > "He was having a fit, swearing up a storm," a passenger on the
>> > flight said. "He was saying 'F this' and 'F that.'"
>>
>> > When confronted about it by passengers, the pilot became "obscene"
>> > and began cursing at the customers, she said. "He made a big
>> > disturbance."
>>
>> > The Las Vegas Metropolitan Police and the local FAA flight
>> > standards office were notified, Gregor said. Police arrived on the
>> > scene, pulled the pilot aside and interviewed him.
>>
>> > He was not administered a field sobriety test. Gregor said he did
>> > not know the reasons behind that decision and CNN was unable to
>> > immediately contact the police officers involved.
>>
>> > The FAA officials called Northwest Airlines headquarters and were
>> > instructed by the chief pilot for the company to remove the pilot
>> > from the aircraft. The chief pilot also requested that the pilot be
>> > flown to Detroit for further questioning, Gregor said.
>>
>> > Northwest Airlines then canceled the flight, apologized for the
>> > delay and offered hotel accommodations and penalty-free re-booking
>> > on the next available flight out of Las Vegas, a spokesman for the
>> > airline said.
>>
>> > The airline said "a review of the matter" was being conducted and
>> > the decision to cancel the flight was made "due to reports of
>> > inappropriate language by a crew member."
>>
>> > Mike Fergus, an FAA spokesman, said the FAA's flight standards
>> > investigation unit was looking into the incident. According to
>> > Fergus, the FAA has the authority to send a "letter of admonition"
>> > to the pilot or, in the most extreme cases, revoke a pilot's FAA
>> > certificate, which would ground the pilot.
>>
>> > "I had to call and cancel two family dinners and we're stuck here
>> > an extra night," a passenger said. "We've been at the airport for
>> > six hours waiting -- it's chaos. It's Easter weekend...we want to
>> > be home."
>>
>> > * w w w .cnn . com /2007/US/04/07/swearing.pilot/index.html- Hide
>> >quoted text -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -
>
> Just because somebody is swearing and cursing does not mean they are
> an emotional basket case, it just means they are angry. What, were
> they worried he was going to have road rage on the runway?
>
> Nearly all pilots are ex-military and they curse a lot in the
> military, this is normal. Then when he was already angry some
> politically correct passenger tried to admonish him, what a crock, he
> is the captain of the plane, not some crummy hired hand. Being angry
> would not have diminished his safety awareness.

SWEARGING would not have diminished his safety awareness. Being angry
surely could have done so.

Re: Obscene pilot forces Northwest to cancel flight


> Being angry
> would not have diminished his safety awareness.

Care to bet the sticker price of a Boeing on that?

Neither did Northwest.

Re: Obscene pilot forces Northwest to cancel flight


"SpammersDie" <xx@xx.xx> wrote in message
news:4V8Sh.266147$5j1.57506@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att . net ...
>
>> Being angry
>> would not have diminished his safety awareness.
>
> Care to bet the sticker price of a Boeing on that?
>
> Neither did Northwest.
>
They have hull insurance on the plane, which is likely leased anyway. The
liability if they lose a planeload of pax, on the other hand, could finish
off even a healthy company, and NW is far from healthy. I'm no fan of NW,
and fly them as little as possible (hard, given that they are the main
carrier here in MI). But in this case, they did exactly the right thing by
canceling. Airborne road rage isn't the issue, the issue is a pilot having a
bad day and not being able to keep his mind on his work. I don't want my
airplane driver to be playing 'I shoulda said' in his head while his hands
are on the controls. Luck of the draw that they didn't have another crew
with available hours nearby, to cover the flight. Kudos to the other NW
staff on hand that raised the issue to the FAA guy, and to him for calling a
'time out' on the pilot. No airline likes cancelling an already boarded
flight, for obvious reasons, so what they did took guts.

aem sends...

Re: Obscene pilot forces Northwest to cancel flight

On 2007-04-08 10:31:03 -0400, possumrex@yahoo . com said:

> Just because somebody is swearing and cursing does not mean they are
> an emotional basket case, it just means they are angry. What, were
> they worried he was going to have road rage on the runway?
>
> Nearly all pilots are ex-military and they curse a lot in the
> military, this is normal. Then when he was already angry some
> politically correct passenger tried to admonish him, what a crock, he
> is the captain of the plane, not some crummy hired hand. Being angry
> would not have diminished his safety awareness.

I guess that means that after watching his tantrum, you would have had
no problem at all getting on the plane and letting him fly you?

Re: Obscene pilot forces Northwest to cancel flight


<possumrex@yahoo . com > wrote in message
news:1176042663.281507.49580@b75g2000hsg.googlegroups . com ...
> On Apr 7, 1:43 pm, "Dudley Henriques" <dhenriq...@rcn . com > wrote:
>> The real issue here isn't the language used by the pilot per se'. The
>> issue
>> of importance is the pilot's emotional and mental state leading up to a
>> take
>> off which the language indicated. This is why the FAA got him off the
>> flight
>> and probably why, after the hearing, he will no longer be employed by
>> Northwest.
>> Frankly, its a good thing they discovered this. Whatever it was he was
>> involved with on that phone, it wasn't consistent with normal flight
>> safety
>> procedures.
>> Dudley Henriques
>>
>> "Thank you for flying F_ck Air" <thank...@forflying.f-ck.air> wrote in
>> messagenews:apjf131bsdm6abatrdfsi8j0mh8d6864t7@news...
>>
>>
>>
>> > Flight canceled after pilot curses at passengers
>> > April 7, 2007
>>
>> > (CNN) -- Northwest Airlines canceled a flight with 180 passengers
>> > aboard after the pilot began cursing at passengers while the plane was
>> > being prepared for takeoff in Las Vegas on Friday, airline officials
>> > and witnesses said.
>>
>> > The cancellation disrupted Easter travel plans for many of the
>> > passengers.
>>
>> > From the moment the captain stepped aboard Flight 1190 to Detroit,
>> > first-class passengers reported hearing him use "animated" language
>> > while talking on his cell phone, Federal Aviation Administration
>> > spokesman Ian Gregor told CNN.
>>
>> > "He was having a fit, swearing up a storm," a passenger on the flight
>> > said. "He was saying 'F this' and 'F that.'"
>>
>> > When confronted about it by passengers, the pilot became "obscene" and
>> > began cursing at the customers, she said. "He made a big disturbance."
>>
>> > The Las Vegas Metropolitan Police and the local FAA flight standards
>> > office were notified, Gregor said. Police arrived on the scene, pulled
>> > the pilot aside and interviewed him.
>>
>> > He was not administered a field sobriety test. Gregor said he did not
>> > know the reasons behind that decision and CNN was unable to
>> > immediately contact the police officers involved.
>>
>> > The FAA officials called Northwest Airlines headquarters and were
>> > instructed by the chief pilot for the company to remove the pilot from
>> > the aircraft. The chief pilot also requested that the pilot be flown
>> > to Detroit for further questioning, Gregor said.
>>
>> > Northwest Airlines then canceled the flight, apologized for the delay
>> > and offered hotel accommodations and penalty-free re-booking on the
>> > next available flight out of Las Vegas, a spokesman for the airline
>> > said.
>>
>> > The airline said "a review of the matter" was being conducted and the
>> > decision to cancel the flight was made "due to reports of
>> > inappropriate language by a crew member."
>>
>> > Mike Fergus, an FAA spokesman, said the FAA's flight standards
>> > investigation unit was looking into the incident. According to Fergus,
>> > the FAA has the authority to send a "letter of admonition" to the
>> > pilot or, in the most extreme cases, revoke a pilot's FAA certificate,
>> > which would ground the pilot.
>>
>> > "I had to call and cancel two family dinners and we're stuck here an
>> > extra night," a passenger said. "We've been at the airport for six
>> > hours waiting -- it's chaos. It's Easter weekend...we want to be
>> > home."
>>
>> > * w w w .cnn . com /2007/US/04/07/swearing.pilot/index.html- Hide quoted
>> >text -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -
>
> Just because somebody is swearing and cursing does not mean they are
> an emotional basket case, it just means they are angry. What, were
> they worried he was going to have road rage on the runway?
>
> Nearly all pilots are ex-military and they curse a lot in the
> military, this is normal. Then when he was already angry some
> politically correct passenger tried to admonish him, what a crock, he
> is the captain of the plane, not some crummy hired hand. Being angry
> would not have diminished his safety awareness.

Being in the flight safety business for over 50 years I would respectfully
disagree with you on all counts.
You're completely self derived discription of the passenger being
"politically correct" in questioning the pilot's behavior as well informs me
that what I think about this matter probably won't be affecting your opinion
all that much either :-))
Anyway.....a pilot displaying an obvious overstress condition such as
shouting and/or cursing loudly, especially involved in this activity
concerning issues not related to the flight, is a condition rightfully
considered to be out of the context of normal pre-flight behavior and as
such rightfully suspect as a flight safety condition.
Dudley Henriques

Re: Obscene pilot forces Northwest to cancel flight

On Sun, 8 Apr 2007 13:36:53 -0400, "Dudley Henriques"
<dhenriques@rcn . com > graced this newsgroup with:


<snip>



>> Nearly all pilots are ex-military and they curse a lot in the
>> military, this is normal. Then when he was already angry some
>> politically correct passenger tried to admonish him, what a crock, he
>> is the captain of the plane, not some crummy hired hand. Being angry
>> would not have diminished his safety awareness.
>
>Being in the flight safety business for over 50 years I would respectfully
>disagree with you on all counts.
>You're completely self derived discription of the passenger being
>"politically correct" in questioning the pilot's behavior as well informs me
>that what I think about this matter probably won't be affecting your opinion
>all that much either :-))
>Anyway.....a pilot displaying an obvious overstress condition such as
>shouting and/or cursing loudly, especially involved in this activity
>concerning issues not related to the flight, is a condition rightfully
>considered to be out of the context of normal pre-flight behavior and as
>such rightfully suspect as a flight safety condition.
>Dudley Henriques
>


Yup...I don't know about anyone else, but I wouldn't want to be a
passenger on a plane who's pilot may be going through a serious case
of road rage at 25,000 ft.

Re: Obscene pilot forces Northwest to cancel flight


>
> Yup...I don't know about anyone else, but I wouldn't want to be a
> passenger on a plane who's pilot may be going through a serious case
> of road rage at 25,000 ft.
>
The safety issue is not road rage, it is innattention.

Peter

Re: Obscene pilot forces Northwest to cancel flight

On Sun, 8 Apr 2007 20:29:33 -0400, "Peter Dohm"
<lefty133@bellsouth . net > graced this newsgroup with:

>
>>
>> Yup...I don't know about anyone else, but I wouldn't want to be a
>> passenger on a plane who's pilot may be going through a serious case
>> of road rage at 25,000 ft.
>>
>The safety issue is not road rage, it is innattention.
>
>Peter
>

I don't think the two are mutually exclusive.

Re: Obscene pilot forces Northwest to cancel flight

> >>
> >> Yup...I don't know about anyone else, but I wouldn't want to be a
> >> passenger on a plane who's pilot may be going through a serious case
> >> of road rage at 25,000 ft.
> >>
> >The safety issue is not road rage, it is innattention.
> >
> >Peter
> >
>
> I don't think the two are mutually exclusive.
>
You're right, ther're not--and I didn't think of that at the time.

However, there is also the question of why we are taking a third hand story
as Gospel, and debating it. As an interesting aside, one of the local radio
stations in my area recognized an obvious dichotomy, however briefly, by
advertising themselves as "Your News and Information Station."

Peter

Re: Obscene pilot forces Northwest to cancel flight

Dudley Henriques wrote
> Being in the flight safety business for over 50 years....
.....Much stuff snipped.

Dudley...don't you think that it is probably time to get into the
"snipping long posts" business?

Bob Moore

Re: Obscene pilot forces Northwest to cancel flight

On Apr 8, 10:31 am, possum...@yahoo . com wrote:
> On Apr 7, 1:43 pm, "Dudley Henriques" <dhenriq...@rcn . com > wrote:
>
>
>
> > The real issue here isn't the language used by the pilot per se'. The issue
> > of importance is the pilot's emotional and mental state leading up to a take
> > off which the language indicated. This is why the FAA got him off the flight
> > and probably why, after the hearing, he will no longer be employed by
> > Northwest.
> > Frankly, its a good thing they discovered this. Whatever it was he was
> > involved with on that phone, it wasn't consistent with normal flight safety
> > procedures.
> > Dudley Henriques
>
> > "Thank you for flying F ck Air" <thank...@forflying.f-ck.air> wrote in
> > messagenews:apjf131bsdm6abatrdfsi8j0mh8d6864t7@news...
>
> > > Flight canceled after pilot curses at passengers
> > > April 7, 2007
>
> > > (CNN) -- Northwest Airlines canceled a flight with 180 passengers
> > > aboard after the pilot began cursing at passengers while the plane was
> > > being prepared for takeoff in Las Vegas on Friday, airline officials
> > > and witnesses said.
>
> > > The cancellation disrupted Easter travel plans for many of the
> > > passengers.
>
> > > From the moment the captain stepped aboard Flight 1190 to Detroit,
> > > first-class passengers reported hearing him use "animated" language
> > > while talking on his cell phone, Federal Aviation Administration
> > > spokesman Ian Gregor told CNN.
>
> > > "He was having a fit, swearing up a storm," a passenger on the flight
> > > said. "He was saying 'F this' and 'F that.'"
>
> > > When confronted about it by passengers, the pilot became "obscene" and
> > > began cursing at the customers, she said. "He made a big disturbance."
>
> > > The Las Vegas Metropolitan Police and the local FAA flight standards
> > > office were notified, Gregor said. Police arrived on the scene, pulled
> > > the pilot aside and interviewed him.
>
> > > He was not administered a field sobriety test. Gregor said he did not
> > > know the reasons behind that decision and CNN was unable to
> > > immediately contact the police officers involved.
>
> > > The FAA officials called Northwest Airlines headquarters and were
> > > instructed by the chief pilot for the company to remove the pilot from
> > > the aircraft. The chief pilot also requested that the pilot be flown
> > > to Detroit for further questioning, Gregor said.
>
> > > Northwest Airlines then canceled the flight, apologized for the delay
> > > and offered hotel accommodations and penalty-free re-booking on the
> > > next available flight out of Las Vegas, a spokesman for the airline
> > > said.
>
> > > The airline said "a review of the matter" was being conducted and the
> > > decision to cancel the flight was made "due to reports of
> > > inappropriate language by a crew member."
>
> > > Mike Fergus, an FAA spokesman, said the FAA's flight standards
> > > investigation unit was looking into the incident. According to Fergus,
> > > the FAA has the authority to send a "letter of admonition" to the
> > > pilot or, in the most extreme cases, revoke a pilot's FAA certificate,
> > > which would ground the pilot.
>
> > > "I had to call and cancel two family dinners and we're stuck here an
> > > extra night," a passenger said. "We've been at the airport for six
> > > hours waiting -- it's chaos. It's Easter weekend...we want to be
> > > home."
>
> > > * w w w .cnn . com /2007/US/04/07/swearing.pilot/index.html-Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> Just because somebody is swearing and cursing does not mean they are
> an emotional basket case, it just means they are angry. What, were
> they worried he was going to have road rage on the runway?
>
> Nearly all pilots are ex-military and they curse a lot in the
> military, this is normal. Then when he was already angry some
> politically correct passenger tried to admonish him,

A person who pays for a first-class ticket expects convenience and
comfort, not vulgar crap. Nothing "politically incorrect" about
complaining of it. And someone who was a military pilot was most
likely "an officer and a gentleman," as the standard expression goes.
He should know how to keep it down in front of civilians.

David Ames

Re: Obscene pilot forces Northwest to cancel flight

On 2007-04-08 13:45:47 -0400, "David Ames" <worldrecord@juno . com > said:

> And someone who was a military pilot was most
> likely "an officer and a gentleman," as the standard expression goes.
> He should know how to keep it down in front of civilians.

Agreed, but there's no indication that THIS pilot was formerly with the
military. That was an unjustified conclusion arrived at by "possumrex",
whatever HE is.