Ping Paul B

Ping Paul B

You might like these Paul, especially the second one..

http :// alt.coxnewsweb,com /ajc/swf/blueangels/blueangels.swf

T.

Re: Ping Paul B


"Tony Gartshore" <ditch@bogsnorkle,com > wrote in message
news:MPG.226f05b9711ae485989751@news.plus,net ...
> You might like these Paul, especially the second one..
>
> http :// alt.coxnewsweb,com /ajc/swf/blueangels/blueangels.swf
>
> T.

LOL. The reporter did pretty good. 7.5g is a big blow. In reality, 10-20%
of specially selected fighter pilot trainee invitees pass out in the
centrifuge at 7g before ever flying these aircraft.

Re: Ping Paul B

"Agent 86" <agent86@control.org> wrote in
news:60641$4804fae1$d15a93ca$19104@PRIMUS.CA:

>
> "Tony Gartshore" <ditch@bogsnorkle,com > wrote in message
> news:MPG.226f05b9711ae485989751@news.plus,net ...
>> You might like these Paul, especially the second one..
>>
>> http :// alt.coxnewsweb,com /ajc/swf/blueangels/blueangels.swf
>>
>> T.
>
> LOL. The reporter did pretty good. 7.5g is a big blow. In reality,
> 10-20% of specially selected fighter pilot trainee invitees pass out
> in the centrifuge at 7g before ever flying these aircraft.
>
Yeah, there was a "reality series" recently where a bunch of "cadets"
were to be trained to fly F-18's. They took the group into a room and an
officer explained how to fight g-forces. There was one guy who looked
bored and had this "this is pointless" expression on his face. He was
the only one to pass out under 4 Gs. The suit and training makes a *big*
difference.

Re: Ping Paul B

APLer wrote:

> "Agent 86" <agent86@control.org> wrote in
> news:60641$4804fae1$d15a93ca$19104@PRIMUS.CA:
>
> >
> > "Tony Gartshore" <ditch@bogsnorkle,com > wrote in message
> > news:MPG.226f05b9711ae485989751@news.plus,net ...
> >> You might like these Paul, especially the second one..
> > >
> >> http :// alt.coxnewsweb,com /ajc/swf/blueangels/blueangels.swf
> > >
> >> T.
> >
> > LOL. The reporter did pretty good. 7.5g is a big blow. In
> > reality, 10-20% of specially selected fighter pilot trainee
> > invitees pass out in the centrifuge at 7g before ever flying these
> > aircraft.
> >
> Yeah, there was a "reality series" recently where a bunch of "cadets"
> were to be trained to fly F-18's. They took the group into a room and
> an officer explained how to fight g-forces. There was one guy who
> looked bored and had this "this is pointless" expression on his face.
> He was the only one to pass out under 4 Gs. The suit and training
> makes a big difference.

I'd have thought that under 4g is poor for a young man regardless of
lack of training...even for just visual blacking out no matter actually
passing out.

--
This space has deliberately not been left blank.
If you would like to advertise here f*ck off!

Re: Ping Paul B


"Bigbird" <Bigbird.UsenetREMOVTHS@Gmail,com > wrote in message
news:xn0fp04lt8qlfw000@news.individual,net ...
> APLer wrote:
>
>> "Agent 86" <agent86@control.org> wrote in
>> news:60641$4804fae1$d15a93ca$19104@PRIMUS.CA:
>>
>> >
>> > "Tony Gartshore" <ditch@bogsnorkle,com > wrote in message
>> > news:MPG.226f05b9711ae485989751@news.plus,net ...
>> >> You might like these Paul, especially the second one..
>> > >
>> >> http :// alt.coxnewsweb,com /ajc/swf/blueangels/blueangels.swf
>> > >
>> >> T.
>> >
>> > LOL. The reporter did pretty good. 7.5g is a big blow. In
>> > reality, 10-20% of specially selected fighter pilot trainee
>> > invitees pass out in the centrifuge at 7g before ever flying these
>> > aircraft.
>> >
>> Yeah, there was a "reality series" recently where a bunch of "cadets"
>> were to be trained to fly F-18's. They took the group into a room and
>> an officer explained how to fight g-forces. There was one guy who
>> looked bored and had this "this is pointless" expression on his face.
>> He was the only one to pass out under 4 Gs. The suit and training
>> makes a big difference.
>
> I'd have thought that under 4g is poor for a young man regardless of
> lack of training...even for just visual blacking out no matter actually
> passing out.
>

I could manage 4g on this http :// snurl,com /24luj without much effort ;-)

Re: Ping Paul B

Bigbird wrote:
> APLer wrote:
>
>> "Agent 86" <agent86@control.org> wrote in
>> news:60641$4804fae1$d15a93ca$19104@PRIMUS.CA:
>>
>>> "Tony Gartshore" <ditch@bogsnorkle,com > wrote in message
>>> news:MPG.226f05b9711ae485989751@news.plus,net ...
>>>> You might like these Paul, especially the second one..
>>>>
>>>> http :// alt.coxnewsweb,com /ajc/swf/blueangels/blueangels.swf
>>>>
>>>> T.
>>> LOL. The reporter did pretty good. 7.5g is a big blow. In
>>> reality, 10-20% of specially selected fighter pilot trainee
>>> invitees pass out in the centrifuge at 7g before ever flying these
>>> aircraft.
>>>
>> Yeah, there was a "reality series" recently where a bunch of "cadets"
>> were to be trained to fly F-18's. They took the group into a room and
>> an officer explained how to fight g-forces. There was one guy who
>> looked bored and had this "this is pointless" expression on his face.
>> He was the only one to pass out under 4 Gs. The suit and training
>> makes a big difference.
>
> I'd have thought that under 4g is poor for a young man regardless of
> lack of training...even for just visual blacking out no matter actually
> passing out.
>

I experienced a little bit of tunnel vision during spin training, and if
I remember correctly (this was more than 10 years ago), we would pull 3
to 3.5 G during aggressive spin recovery. With sustained 4G in the
centrifuge, I guess blacking-out is definitely an issue if you don't
apply the proper techniques.

Re: Ping Paul B

RdKetchup wrote:

> Bigbird wrote:
> > APLer wrote:
> >
> >>"Agent 86" <agent86@control.org> wrote in
> > > news:60641$4804fae1$d15a93ca$19104@PRIMUS.CA:
> >>>"Tony Gartshore" <ditch@bogsnorkle,com > wrote in message
> news:MPG.226f05b9711ae485989751@news.plus,net ...
> > > > > You might like these Paul, especially the second one..
> > > > >
> > > > > http :// alt.coxnewsweb,com /ajc/swf/blueangels/blueangels.swf
> > > > >
> > > > > T.
> > > > LOL. The reporter did pretty good. 7.5g is a big blow. In
> > > > reality, 10-20% of specially selected fighter pilot trainee
> > > > invitees pass out in the centrifuge at 7g before ever flying
> > > > these aircraft.
> > > >
> > > Yeah, there was a "reality series" recently where a bunch of
> > > "cadets" were to be trained to fly F-18's. They took the group
> > > into a room and an officer explained how to fight g-forces. There
> > > was one guy who looked bored and had this "this is pointless"
> > > expression on his face. He was the only one to pass out under 4
> > > Gs. The suit and training makes a big difference.
> >
> > I'd have thought that under 4g is poor for a young man regardless of
> > lack of training...even for just visual blacking out no matter
> > actually passing out.
> >
>
> I experienced a little bit of tunnel vision during spin training, and
> if I remember correctly (this was more than 10 years ago), we would
> pull 3 to 3.5 G during aggressive spin recovery. With sustained 4G
> in the centrifuge, I guess blacking-out is definitely an issue if you
> don't apply the proper techniques.

Just realised I was remembering slightly wrong. I had thought 4.5g was
what I experienced, in the first loop on my very first flight, when I
just started to have tunnel vision. In fact it was nearer 4g.

4.5g is what I pulled when it was my turn...and my pilot started to
blackout. I think I just kept pulling harder trying to recreate the
same feel as the first time, which was never going to happen. I was far
from relaxed to say the least.

--
This space has deliberately not been left blank.
If you would like to advertise here f*ck off!

Re: Ping Paul B

"Bigbird" <Bigbird.UsenetREMOVTHS@Gmail,com > wrote in
news:xn0fp07f3cithh001@news.individual,net :

> RdKetchup wrote:
>
>> Bigbird wrote:
>> > APLer wrote:
>> >
>> >>"Agent 86" <agent86@control.org> wrote in
>> > > news:60641$4804fae1$d15a93ca$19104@PRIMUS.CA:
>> >>>"Tony Gartshore" <ditch@bogsnorkle,com > wrote in message
>> news:MPG.226f05b9711ae485989751@news.plus,net ...
>> > > > > You might like these Paul, especially the second one..

>> > > Yeah, there was a "reality series" recently where a bunch of
>> > > "cadets" were to be trained to fly F-18's. They took the group
>> > > into a room and an officer explained how to fight g-forces. There
>> > > was one guy who looked bored and had this "this is pointless"
>> > > expression on his face. He was the only one to pass out under 4
>> > > Gs. The suit and training makes a big difference.
>> >
>> > I'd have thought that under 4g is poor for a young man regardless
>> > of lack of training...even for just visual blacking out no matter
>> > actually passing out.
>> >
>>
>> I experienced a little bit of tunnel vision during spin training, and
>> if I remember correctly (this was more than 10 years ago), we would
>> pull 3 to 3.5 G during aggressive spin recovery. With sustained 4G
>> in the centrifuge, I guess blacking-out is definitely an issue if you
>> don't apply the proper techniques.
>
> Just realised I was remembering slightly wrong. I had thought 4.5g was
> what I experienced, in the first loop on my very first flight, when I
> just started to have tunnel vision. In fact it was nearer 4g.
>
> 4.5g is what I pulled when it was my turn...and my pilot started to
> blackout. I think I just kept pulling harder trying to recreate the
> same feel as the first time, which was never going to happen. I was
> far from relaxed to say the least.
>
Not a problem. I was shocked it was so low. To say nothing of how
quickly he went under. They announced the forces and his head just
dropped forward. No warning. After all Spitfire pilots used the beat
that. As an aside the highest forces was by a girl.

BTW it was Jetstream

http :// www .discoverychannel.ca/jetstream/


Now all we need are cars (4 axles?) that can do 6 gees in cornering. <g>
Great way to separate the men from the boys.

Re: Ping Paul B

In article <Xns9A827399A9797APLer@127.0.0.1>, APLer@floor.tilde says...
> > 4.5g is what I pulled when it was my turn...and my pilot started to
> > blackout. I think I just kept pulling harder trying to recreate the
> > same feel as the first time, which was never going to happen. I was
> > far from relaxed to say the least.
> >
> Not a problem. I was shocked it was so low. To say nothing of how
> quickly he went under. They announced the forces and his head just
> dropped forward. No warning. After all Spitfire pilots used the beat
> that. As an aside the highest forces was by a girl.
>
> BTW it was Jetstream
>
> http :// www .discoverychannel.ca/jetstream/
>
>
> Now all we need are cars (4 axles?) that can do 6 gees in cornering. <g>
> Great way to separate the men from the boys.
>

I remember reading something a few years back about the F-16 AFTI or
maybe XL, the one with the canards mounted vertically UNDER the
fuselage. It could perform sharp turns withouit having to bank into the
turn.

I was said that it proved that the human body may be able to perform
under +7g or -4g, but it couldn't stand 2 or 3 g trying to push the
pilots brain out of his ears ! Tried Googling but can't find anything,
so maybe I dreamt the whole thing..

T.
>

Re: Ping Paul B

Tony Gartshore <ditch@bogsnorkle,com > wrote in
news:MPG.22707eb2c15066f8989754@news.plus,net :

> In article <Xns9A827399A9797APLer@127.0.0.1>, APLer@floor.tilde
> says...
>> > 4.5g is what I pulled when it was my turn...and my pilot started to
>> > blackout. I think I just kept pulling harder trying to recreate the
>> > same feel as the first time, which was never going to happen. I was
>> > far from relaxed to say the least.
>> >
>> Not a problem. I was shocked it was so low. To say nothing of how
>> quickly he went under. They announced the forces and his head just
>> dropped forward. No warning. After all Spitfire pilots used the beat
>> that. As an aside the highest forces was by a girl.
>>
>> BTW it was Jetstream
>>
>> http :// www .discoverychannel.ca/jetstream/
>>
>>
>> Now all we need are cars (4 axles?) that can do 6 gees in cornering.
>> <g> Great way to separate the men from the boys.
>>
>
> I remember reading something a few years back about the F-16 AFTI or
> maybe XL, the one with the canards mounted vertically UNDER the
> fuselage. It could perform sharp turns withouit having to bank into
> the turn.
>
> I was said that it proved that the human body may be able to perform
> under +7g or -4g, but it couldn't stand 2 or 3 g trying to push the
> pilots brain out of his ears ! Tried Googling but can't find
> anything, so maybe I dreamt the whole thing..
>

The human *body* can withstand about 80g's. This was shown by a very
courageous US army officer in the 60's with the help of a rocket sled.
I have since seen a reference to him here. I'm not sure that the g's are
right, though, they seem too high. The human brain however without oxygen
is limited to between -5 and +10 max. The problem is the blood pressure
is not enough to counteract the "new" gravity, so the brain starves of
oxygen and you blackout. This is positive G's. Negative g's the blood
can't *leave* the brain nor can new blood get in and gets it's oxygen
used up to the same effect. Without circulation to the brain in *and*
out, you go unconcious very quickly and will eventually die if the cause
is not stopped of course.

Re: Ping Paul B


"APLer" <APLer@floor.tilde> wrote in message
news:Xns9A839C870F92FAPLer@127.0.0.1...
> Tony Gartshore <ditch@bogsnorkle,com > wrote in
> news:MPG.22707eb2c15066f8989754@news.plus,net :
>
>> In article <Xns9A827399A9797APLer@127.0.0.1>, APLer@floor.tilde
>> says...
>>> > 4.5g is what I pulled when it was my turn...and my pilot started to
>>> > blackout. I think I just kept pulling harder trying to recreate the
>>> > same feel as the first time, which was never going to happen. I was
>>> > far from relaxed to say the least.
>>> >
>>> Not a problem. I was shocked it was so low. To say nothing of how
>>> quickly he went under. They announced the forces and his head just
>>> dropped forward. No warning. After all Spitfire pilots used the beat
>>> that. As an aside the highest forces was by a girl.
>>>
>>> BTW it was Jetstream
>>>
>>> http :// www .discoverychannel.ca/jetstream/
>>>
>>>
>>> Now all we need are cars (4 axles?) that can do 6 gees in cornering.
>>> <g> Great way to separate the men from the boys.
>>>
>>
>> I remember reading something a few years back about the F-16 AFTI or
>> maybe XL, the one with the canards mounted vertically UNDER the
>> fuselage. It could perform sharp turns withouit having to bank into
>> the turn.
>>
>> I was said that it proved that the human body may be able to perform
>> under +7g or -4g, but it couldn't stand 2 or 3 g trying to push the
>> pilots brain out of his ears ! Tried Googling but can't find
>> anything, so maybe I dreamt the whole thing..
>>
>
> The human *body* can withstand about 80g's. This was shown by a very
> courageous US army officer in the 60's with the help of a rocket sled.
> I have since seen a reference to him here. I'm not sure that the g's are
> right, though, they seem too high. The human brain however without oxygen
> is limited to between -5 and +10 max. The problem is the blood pressure
> is not enough to counteract the "new" gravity, so the brain starves of
> oxygen and you blackout. This is positive G's. Negative g's the blood
> can't *leave* the brain nor can new blood get in and gets it's oxygen
> used up to the same effect. Without circulation to the brain in *and*
> out, you go unconcious very quickly and will eventually die if the cause
> is not stopped of course.
>-------------------------------------------------------

You're referring to Col. John Paul Stapp, kind of a local hero here in
Minnesota. He was a biophysicist who later attended the University of
Minnesota and got his medical degree and turned his attention to flight
surgeon research with the then U.S. Army Air Force. His experiments on the
rocket sled preceded his early work in the development of the aircraft
ejection seat. He reached gravitational forces of 35 gs. I remember when I
was a kid in the late 50s seeing his sled run on a TV news program called
"You asked for it."

--
Hal S.

Re: Ping Paul B

"Hal S." <h.sanders@comcast,net > wrote in
news:u_mdnSN96qaYU5rVnZ2dnUVZ_ommnZ2d@comcast,com :

>
> "APLer" <APLer@floor.tilde> wrote in message
> news:Xns9A839C870F92FAPLer@127.0.0.1...
>> Tony Gartshore <ditch@bogsnorkle,com > wrote in
>> news:MPG.22707eb2c15066f8989754@news.plus,net :
>>
>>> In article <Xns9A827399A9797APLer@127.0.0.1>, APLer@floor.tilde
>>> says...
>>>> > 4.5g is what I pulled when it was my turn...and my pilot started
>>>> > to blackout. I think I just kept pulling harder trying to
>>>> > recreate the same feel as the first time, which was never going
>>>> > to happen. I was far from relaxed to say the least.
>>>> >
>>>> Not a problem. I was shocked it was so low. To say nothing of how
>>>> quickly he went under. They announced the forces and his head just
>>>> dropped forward. No warning. After all Spitfire pilots used the
>>>> beat that. As an aside the highest forces was by a girl.
>>>>
>>>> BTW it was Jetstream
>>>>
>>>> http :// www .discoverychannel.ca/jetstream/
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Now all we need are cars (4 axles?) that can do 6 gees in
>>>> cornering. <g> Great way to separate the men from the boys.
>>>>
>>>
>>> I remember reading something a few years back about the F-16 AFTI or
>>> maybe XL, the one with the canards mounted vertically UNDER the
>>> fuselage. It could perform sharp turns withouit having to bank into
>>> the turn.
>>>
>>> I was said that it proved that the human body may be able to perform
>>> under +7g or -4g, but it couldn't stand 2 or 3 g trying to push the
>>> pilots brain out of his ears ! Tried Googling but can't find
>>> anything, so maybe I dreamt the whole thing..
>>>
>>
>> The human *body* can withstand about 80g's. This was shown by a very
>> courageous US army officer in the 60's with the help of a rocket
>> sled. I have since seen a reference to him here. I'm not sure that
>> the g's are right, though, they seem too high. The human brain
>> however without oxygen is limited to between -5 and +10 max. The
>> problem is the blood pressure is not enough to counteract the "new"
>> gravity, so the brain starves of oxygen and you blackout. This is
>> positive G's. Negative g's the blood can't *leave* the brain nor can
>> new blood get in and gets it's oxygen used up to the same effect.
>> Without circulation to the brain in *and* out, you go unconcious very
>> quickly and will eventually die if the cause is not stopped of
>> course.
>>-------------------------------------------------------
>
> You're referring to Col. John Paul Stapp, kind of a local hero here
> in Minnesota. He was a biophysicist who later attended the University
> of Minnesota and got his medical degree and turned his attention to
> flight surgeon research with the then U.S. Army Air Force. His
> experiments on the rocket sled preceded his early work in the
> development of the aircraft ejection seat. He reached gravitational
> forces of 35 gs. I remember when I was a kid in the late 50s seeing
> his sled run on a TV news program called "You asked for it."
>
Well, that's the *third* number for it I've heard. He actually sustained
a detached retina and as a result was temporarily blind. Wikipaedia says
46.2g. There was an accident a while back where *someone* - I thought it
was Zanardi - was said to have sustained 90+ g's. It seems to me that
*that* was in guiness, but they have reorganized things in such a wierd
way in the last 30 years that finding if such a record is on their web
site or is even kept anymore in virtually impossible. Even the book is
gone that route.

Re: Ping Paul B

On Fri, 18 Apr 2008 23:51:30 +0200 (CEST), APLer wrote:

> Well, that's the *third* number for it I've heard. He actually sustained
> a detached retina and as a result was temporarily blind. Wikipaedia says
> 46.2g. There was an accident a while back where *someone* - I thought it
> was Zanardi - was said to have sustained 90+ g's. It seems to me that
> *that* was in guiness, but they have reorganized things in such a wierd
> way in the last 30 years that finding if such a record is on their web
> site or is even kept anymore in virtually impossible. Even the book is
> gone that route.

David Purley, 179.8G, 1977:

"He returned to F1 in 1977 with his own LEC chassis designed by Mike
Pilbeam and run by Mike Earle. It was this car in which he suffered serious
injuries in pre-qualifying for the British Grand Prix. He survived an
estimated 179.8 G's in 1977 when he decelerated from 173 km/h (108 mph) to
0 in a distance of 66 cm (26 inches) after his throttle got stuck wide open
and he hit a wall."

http :// en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Purley#Career

Re: Ping Paul B

Allen <none@this.one> wrote in
news:1ueayshk5pttd.w0g97plx1q6l.dlg@40tude,net :

> On Fri, 18 Apr 2008 23:51:30 +0200 (CEST), APLer wrote:
>
>> Well, that's the *third* number for it I've heard. He actually
>> sustained a detached retina and as a result was temporarily blind.
>> Wikipaedia says 46.2g. There was an accident a while back where
>> *someone* - I thought it was Zanardi - was said to have sustained 90+
>> g's. It seems to me that *that* was in guiness, but they have
>> reorganized things in such a wierd way in the last 30 years that
>> finding if such a record is on their web site or is even kept anymore
>> in virtually impossible. Even the book is gone that route.
>
> David Purley, 179.8G, 1977:
>
> "He returned to F1 in 1977 with his own LEC chassis designed by Mike
> Pilbeam and run by Mike Earle. It was this car in which he suffered
> serious injuries in pre-qualifying for the British Grand Prix. He
> survived an estimated 179.8 G's in 1977 when he decelerated from 173
> km/h (108 mph) to 0 in a distance of 66 cm (26 inches) after his
> throttle got stuck wide open and he hit a wall."
>
*Ouch* ! Well, that's certainly more, but virually instantaneous (I
guess it would be anyways with that high a number), but the one I was
thinking of was within the last 10 years.

Re: Ping Paul B

APLer wrote:
>
> Now all we need are cars (4 axles?) that can do 6 gees in cornering. <g>
> Great way to separate the men from the boys.

Actually, it would be hardly comparable. The black-out/red-out/g-lock
phenomenon the airplane pilot experience are due to G forces in the
vertical axis (Z), while the usual forces experience by race car drivers
are in the X and Y axis.

Sure the strain on the neck muscle (and probably the arms too) would be
incredible, but I doubt they would experience stuff like tunnel vision
and black-outs.