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Road course ringers, my ass...
Re: Road course ringers, my ass...
electrician@xo,com (Electrician) wrote in news:F%88k.4$td.2@trnddc05:
> Well, let's see how the so called 'ringers' did at Sonoma yesterday:
There's a little more to it than that, tho...
> Ambrose = started 7th, finished 42nd, lost 35 spots
But - he was in contention to win before getting into a wreck.
Since he's not running for points he had little to loose by
driving agressively and trying for the big finish.
> Said = started 14th, finished 41st, lost 27 spots
Mechanical problems, I think.
> Fellows = started 22, finished 29th, lost 7 spots
Just didn't run well, far as I know.
> Pruett = started 27th, finished 38th, lost 11 spots
Caught up in an accident, altho he wasn't setting the world on
fire beforehand.
> Papis = started 28th, finished 35th, lost 7 spots
Damage from someone else's accident, early in the race.
> Simo = srarted 43rd, finished 43rd, even
Mechanical problems.
> At least they are consistent, year in and year out, at finishing
> poorly.
This is probably more an effect of the ringers driving for
backmarker teams, or part-time efforts. Only Pruett and Fellows
were in cars from (more or less) top-tier teams.
John
electrician@xo,com (Electrician) wrote in news:F%88k.4$td.2@trnddc05:
> Well, let's see how the so called 'ringers' did at Sonoma yesterday:
There's a little more to it than that, tho...
> Ambrose = started 7th, finished 42nd, lost 35 spots
But - he was in contention to win before getting into a wreck.
Since he's not running for points he had little to loose by
driving agressively and trying for the big finish.
> Said = started 14th, finished 41st, lost 27 spots
Mechanical problems, I think.
> Fellows = started 22, finished 29th, lost 7 spots
Just didn't run well, far as I know.
> Pruett = started 27th, finished 38th, lost 11 spots
Caught up in an accident, altho he wasn't setting the world on
fire beforehand.
> Papis = started 28th, finished 35th, lost 7 spots
Damage from someone else's accident, early in the race.
> Simo = srarted 43rd, finished 43rd, even
Mechanical problems.
> At least they are consistent, year in and year out, at finishing
> poorly.
This is probably more an effect of the ringers driving for
backmarker teams, or part-time efforts. Only Pruett and Fellows
were in cars from (more or less) top-tier teams.
John
Re: Road course ringers, my ass...
Bottom line on this discussion just has to be:
Ringers generally don't finish well enuf to move
regular teams up in the owner points standings,
so why do owners believe they should replace their
regular drivers with ringers?
I saw no reason to replace Regan Smith, Reed Sorenson,
& Scott Riggs with ringers.
Secondarily how are these drivers gonna get road sperience?
With this mentality, it's no wonder lower-tier owners
stay in the lower tier.
--
Crusader
"John McCoy" <igopogo@ix,net com,com > wrote in message
news:Xns9AC7DFA1397F9pogosupernews@216.168.3.30...
> electrician@xo,com (Electrician) wrote in news:F%88k.4$td.2@trnddc05:
>
>> Well, let's see how the so called 'ringers' did at Sonoma yesterday:
>
> There's a little more to it than that, tho...
>
>> Ambrose = started 7th, finished 42nd, lost 35 spots
>
> But - he was in contention to win before getting into a wreck.
> Since he's not running for points he had little to loose by
> driving agressively and trying for the big finish.
>
>> Said = started 14th, finished 41st, lost 27 spots
>
> Mechanical problems, I think.
>
>> Fellows = started 22, finished 29th, lost 7 spots
>
> Just didn't run well, far as I know.
>
>> Pruett = started 27th, finished 38th, lost 11 spots
>
> Caught up in an accident, altho he wasn't setting the world on
> fire beforehand.
>
>> Papis = started 28th, finished 35th, lost 7 spots
>
> Damage from someone else's accident, early in the race.
>
>> Simo = srarted 43rd, finished 43rd, even
>
> Mechanical problems.
>
>> At least they are consistent, year in and year out, at finishing
>> poorly.
>
> This is probably more an effect of the ringers driving for
> backmarker teams, or part-time efforts. Only Pruett and Fellows
> were in cars from (more or less) top-tier teams.
>
> John
Bottom line on this discussion just has to be:
Ringers generally don't finish well enuf to move
regular teams up in the owner points standings,
so why do owners believe they should replace their
regular drivers with ringers?
I saw no reason to replace Regan Smith, Reed Sorenson,
& Scott Riggs with ringers.
Secondarily how are these drivers gonna get road sperience?
With this mentality, it's no wonder lower-tier owners
stay in the lower tier.
--
Crusader
"John McCoy" <igopogo@ix,net com,com > wrote in message
news:Xns9AC7DFA1397F9pogosupernews@216.168.3.30...
> electrician@xo,com (Electrician) wrote in news:F%88k.4$td.2@trnddc05:
>
>> Well, let's see how the so called 'ringers' did at Sonoma yesterday:
>
> There's a little more to it than that, tho...
>
>> Ambrose = started 7th, finished 42nd, lost 35 spots
>
> But - he was in contention to win before getting into a wreck.
> Since he's not running for points he had little to loose by
> driving agressively and trying for the big finish.
>
>> Said = started 14th, finished 41st, lost 27 spots
>
> Mechanical problems, I think.
>
>> Fellows = started 22, finished 29th, lost 7 spots
>
> Just didn't run well, far as I know.
>
>> Pruett = started 27th, finished 38th, lost 11 spots
>
> Caught up in an accident, altho he wasn't setting the world on
> fire beforehand.
>
>> Papis = started 28th, finished 35th, lost 7 spots
>
> Damage from someone else's accident, early in the race.
>
>> Simo = srarted 43rd, finished 43rd, even
>
> Mechanical problems.
>
>> At least they are consistent, year in and year out, at finishing
>> poorly.
>
> This is probably more an effect of the ringers driving for
> backmarker teams, or part-time efforts. Only Pruett and Fellows
> were in cars from (more or less) top-tier teams.
>
> John
Re: Road course ringers, my ass...
"Mike/Speeed" <speeedracerREMOVE24@verizon,net > wrote in message
news:FU58k.8$Eg.6@trnddc01...
> With finishes of 29th or worse last Sunday, when are these owners going to
> wake up and stop wasting their time & money on these so-called road racing
> specialists?
> These drivers may be good road course racers, but they don't drive in the
> COT or Sprint Cup enough to be competitive at it, & more importantly,
> don't
> have the respect amongst Na$car regulars to drive aggressively against a
> regular and get away with it.
> I've never liked the practice of replacing Cup regulars, or fielding
> one-off
> teams just to garner a few owner points in the first place. If a driver
> cannot drive at ALL of the tracks competitively, perhaps the owner should
> either spend more time training the driver to race road courses, or just
> pursue another *more qualified* wheel man.
>
>
The only person who can drive a 3500 pound stock car is a person who has
driven a 3500 pound stock car a lot. That is so obvious that it should not
even have to be stated. All of this Almindinger and Yeley bullshit is just
a complete waste of time.
It may not be easy to find that next Kenseth or Busch on the local tracks
but the percentage if far higher than to pick some second of third ranked go
kart driver.
"Mike/Speeed" <speeedracerREMOVE24@verizon,net > wrote in message
news:FU58k.8$Eg.6@trnddc01...
> With finishes of 29th or worse last Sunday, when are these owners going to
> wake up and stop wasting their time & money on these so-called road racing
> specialists?
> These drivers may be good road course racers, but they don't drive in the
> COT or Sprint Cup enough to be competitive at it, & more importantly,
> don't
> have the respect amongst Na$car regulars to drive aggressively against a
> regular and get away with it.
> I've never liked the practice of replacing Cup regulars, or fielding
> one-off
> teams just to garner a few owner points in the first place. If a driver
> cannot drive at ALL of the tracks competitively, perhaps the owner should
> either spend more time training the driver to race road courses, or just
> pursue another *more qualified* wheel man.
>
>
The only person who can drive a 3500 pound stock car is a person who has
driven a 3500 pound stock car a lot. That is so obvious that it should not
even have to be stated. All of this Almindinger and Yeley bullshit is just
a complete waste of time.
It may not be easy to find that next Kenseth or Busch on the local tracks
but the percentage if far higher than to pick some second of third ranked go
kart driver.
Re: Road course ringers, my ass...
"Mike/Speeed" <speeedracerREMOVE24@verizon,net > wrote in
news:FU58k.8$Eg.6@trnddc01:
> With finishes of 29th or worse last Sunday, when are these owners
> going to wake up and stop wasting their time & money on these
> so-called road racing specialists?
Given that most the ringers this time round were driving for teams
worried about points, that's a good question. Putting a ringer in
to go for the win makes sense. But not to run for points - if you
need a good points finish, what makes sense is to have a ringer
qualify the car for you, running the one good lap, and then put
the regular guy in and tell him just to stay in line and stay out
of trouble. Assuming a decent qual position, even a guy who's
bad on the road courses can likely get a top 30 finish, with
passing being as hard as it is.
John
"Mike/Speeed" <speeedracerREMOVE24@verizon,net > wrote in
news:FU58k.8$Eg.6@trnddc01:
> With finishes of 29th or worse last Sunday, when are these owners
> going to wake up and stop wasting their time & money on these
> so-called road racing specialists?
Given that most the ringers this time round were driving for teams
worried about points, that's a good question. Putting a ringer in
to go for the win makes sense. But not to run for points - if you
need a good points finish, what makes sense is to have a ringer
qualify the car for you, running the one good lap, and then put
the regular guy in and tell him just to stay in line and stay out
of trouble. Assuming a decent qual position, even a guy who's
bad on the road courses can likely get a top 30 finish, with
passing being as hard as it is.
John
Re: Road course ringers, my ass...
"John McCoy" <igopogo@ix,net com,com > wrote in message
news:Xns9AC7DD61D9874pogosupernews@216.168.3.30...
> "Mike/Speeed" <speeedracerREMOVE24@verizon,net > wrote in
> news:FU58k.8$Eg.6@trnddc01:
>
> > With finishes of 29th or worse last Sunday, when are these owners
> > going to wake up and stop wasting their time & money on these
> > so-called road racing specialists?
>
> Given that most the ringers this time round were driving for teams
> worried about points, that's a good question. Putting a ringer in
> to go for the win makes sense. But not to run for points - if you
> need a good points finish, what makes sense is to have a ringer
> qualify the car for you, running the one good lap, and then put
> the regular guy in and tell him just to stay in line and stay out
> of trouble. Assuming a decent qual position, even a guy who's
> bad on the road courses can likely get a top 30 finish, with
> passing being as hard as it is.
>
> John
Do the rules even allow for one driver to qualify for another anymore? And
even if they do, wouldn't the car start in the back?
"John McCoy" <igopogo@ix,net com,com > wrote in message
news:Xns9AC7DD61D9874pogosupernews@216.168.3.30...
> "Mike/Speeed" <speeedracerREMOVE24@verizon,net > wrote in
> news:FU58k.8$Eg.6@trnddc01:
>
> > With finishes of 29th or worse last Sunday, when are these owners
> > going to wake up and stop wasting their time & money on these
> > so-called road racing specialists?
>
> Given that most the ringers this time round were driving for teams
> worried about points, that's a good question. Putting a ringer in
> to go for the win makes sense. But not to run for points - if you
> need a good points finish, what makes sense is to have a ringer
> qualify the car for you, running the one good lap, and then put
> the regular guy in and tell him just to stay in line and stay out
> of trouble. Assuming a decent qual position, even a guy who's
> bad on the road courses can likely get a top 30 finish, with
> passing being as hard as it is.
>
> John
Do the rules even allow for one driver to qualify for another anymore? And
even if they do, wouldn't the car start in the back?
Re: Road course ringers, my ass...
"armpit" <armarmpitpit@yahoo,com > wrote in
news:grednVYg1oCTOfzVnZ2dnUVZ_gGdnZ2d@giganews,com :
> Do the rules even allow for one driver to qualify for another anymore?
Yes, no problem with that...
> And even if they do, wouldn't the car start in the back?
But yeah, I forgot that detail. So really, if points is what you're
worried about, the only time a ringer would be useful would be if
you're pretty sure your regular driver won't qualify.
John
"armpit" <armarmpitpit@yahoo,com > wrote in
news:grednVYg1oCTOfzVnZ2dnUVZ_gGdnZ2d@giganews,com :
> Do the rules even allow for one driver to qualify for another anymore?
Yes, no problem with that...
> And even if they do, wouldn't the car start in the back?
But yeah, I forgot that detail. So really, if points is what you're
worried about, the only time a ringer would be useful would be if
you're pretty sure your regular driver won't qualify.
John
Re: Road course ringers, my ass...
"John McCoy" <igopogo@ix,net com,com > wrote in message
news:Xns9AC8C09FC3A68pogosupernews@216.168.3.30...
> "armpit" <armarmpitpit@yahoo,com > wrote in
> news:grednVYg1oCTOfzVnZ2dnUVZ_gGdnZ2d@giganews,com :
>
> > Do the rules even allow for one driver to qualify for another anymore?
>
> Yes, no problem with that...
>
> > And even if they do, wouldn't the car start in the back?
>
> But yeah, I forgot that detail. So really, if points is what you're
> worried about, the only time a ringer would be useful would be if
> you're pretty sure your regular driver won't qualify.
>
> John
>
Actually, I kind of liked >G<'s idea of putting the ringer in the car at the
first pit stop.
"John McCoy" <igopogo@ix,net com,com > wrote in message
news:Xns9AC8C09FC3A68pogosupernews@216.168.3.30...
> "armpit" <armarmpitpit@yahoo,com > wrote in
> news:grednVYg1oCTOfzVnZ2dnUVZ_gGdnZ2d@giganews,com :
>
> > Do the rules even allow for one driver to qualify for another anymore?
>
> Yes, no problem with that...
>
> > And even if they do, wouldn't the car start in the back?
>
> But yeah, I forgot that detail. So really, if points is what you're
> worried about, the only time a ringer would be useful would be if
> you're pretty sure your regular driver won't qualify.
>
> John
>
Actually, I kind of liked >G<'s idea of putting the ringer in the car at the
first pit stop.
Re: Road course ringers, my ass...
John McCoy wrote:
> "Mike/Speeed" <speeedracerREMOVE24@verizon,net > wrote in
> news:FU58k.8$Eg.6@trnddc01:
>
>> With finishes of 29th or worse last Sunday, when are these owners
>> going to wake up and stop wasting their time & money on these
>> so-called road racing specialists?
>
> Given that most the ringers this time round were driving for teams
> worried about points, that's a good question. Putting a ringer in
> to go for the win makes sense. But not to run for points - if you
> need a good points finish, what makes sense is to have a ringer
> qualify the car for you, running the one good lap, and then put
> the regular guy in and tell him just to stay in line and stay out
> of trouble. Assuming a decent qual position, even a guy who's
> bad on the road courses can likely get a top 30 finish, with
> passing being as hard as it is.
>
> John
OK so with the track so long and the ability to make up places on after
a pit stop if a caution comes out, why not start the every week guy, so
he gets the points, and make a short stop after a few (10) laps, swap to
the ringer and go for it. sounds like they'd be no worse for wear...
--
>G< ©
John McCoy wrote:
> "Mike/Speeed" <speeedracerREMOVE24@verizon,net > wrote in
> news:FU58k.8$Eg.6@trnddc01:
>
>> With finishes of 29th or worse last Sunday, when are these owners
>> going to wake up and stop wasting their time & money on these
>> so-called road racing specialists?
>
> Given that most the ringers this time round were driving for teams
> worried about points, that's a good question. Putting a ringer in
> to go for the win makes sense. But not to run for points - if you
> need a good points finish, what makes sense is to have a ringer
> qualify the car for you, running the one good lap, and then put
> the regular guy in and tell him just to stay in line and stay out
> of trouble. Assuming a decent qual position, even a guy who's
> bad on the road courses can likely get a top 30 finish, with
> passing being as hard as it is.
>
> John
OK so with the track so long and the ability to make up places on after
a pit stop if a caution comes out, why not start the every week guy, so
he gets the points, and make a short stop after a few (10) laps, swap to
the ringer and go for it. sounds like they'd be no worse for wear...
--
>G< ©
Re: Road course ringers, my ass...
"John McCoy" <igopogo@ix,net com,com > wrote in message
news:Xns9AC7DD61D9874pogosupernews@216.168.3.30...
> "Mike/Speeed" <speeedracerREMOVE24@verizon,net > wrote in
> news:FU58k.8$Eg.6@trnddc01:
>
>> With finishes of 29th or worse last Sunday, when are these owners
>> going to wake up and stop wasting their time & money on these
>> so-called road racing specialists?
>
> Given that most the ringers this time round were driving for teams
> worried about points,
The ringers have always been in cars worried about points.
--
-Mike-
mmarlowREMOVE@alltel,net
"John McCoy" <igopogo@ix,net com,com > wrote in message
news:Xns9AC7DD61D9874pogosupernews@216.168.3.30...
> "Mike/Speeed" <speeedracerREMOVE24@verizon,net > wrote in
> news:FU58k.8$Eg.6@trnddc01:
>
>> With finishes of 29th or worse last Sunday, when are these owners
>> going to wake up and stop wasting their time & money on these
>> so-called road racing specialists?
>
> Given that most the ringers this time round were driving for teams
> worried about points,
The ringers have always been in cars worried about points.
--
-Mike-
mmarlowREMOVE@alltel,net
Re: Road course ringers, my ass...
"Mike Marlow" <mmarlowREMOVE@alltel,net > wrote in news:3e4b9$4861ced4
$a227014e$14583@ALLTEL,net :
> The ringers have always been in cars worried about points.
Not so. Until recently, the ringers would usually be in a part-time
car - e.g. Fellows running in Childress's fourth car at the Glen.
John
"Mike Marlow" <mmarlowREMOVE@alltel,net > wrote in news:3e4b9$4861ced4
$a227014e$14583@ALLTEL,net :
> The ringers have always been in cars worried about points.
Not so. Until recently, the ringers would usually be in a part-time
car - e.g. Fellows running in Childress's fourth car at the Glen.
John
Re: Road course ringers, my ass...
"John McCoy" <igopogo@ix,net com,com > wrote in message
news:Xns9AC8C0F07E6DApogosupernews@216.168.3.30...
> "Mike Marlow" <mmarlowREMOVE@alltel,net > wrote in news:3e4b9$4861ced4
> $a227014e$14583@ALLTEL,net :
>
>> The ringers have always been in cars worried about points.
>
> Not so. Until recently, the ringers would usually be in a part-time
> car - e.g. Fellows running in Childress's fourth car at the Glen.
>
Some sure, but drivers like Said and others displaced a lot of Cup regulars
way back into the 90's when owners thought they could get a better show out
of them. Used to be lots of pissed off Cup drivers when they had to move
out to make room for the ringers.
--
-Mike-
mmarlowREMOVE@alltel,net
"John McCoy" <igopogo@ix,net com,com > wrote in message
news:Xns9AC8C0F07E6DApogosupernews@216.168.3.30...
> "Mike Marlow" <mmarlowREMOVE@alltel,net > wrote in news:3e4b9$4861ced4
> $a227014e$14583@ALLTEL,net :
>
>> The ringers have always been in cars worried about points.
>
> Not so. Until recently, the ringers would usually be in a part-time
> car - e.g. Fellows running in Childress's fourth car at the Glen.
>
Some sure, but drivers like Said and others displaced a lot of Cup regulars
way back into the 90's when owners thought they could get a better show out
of them. Used to be lots of pissed off Cup drivers when they had to move
out to make room for the ringers.
--
-Mike-
mmarlowREMOVE@alltel,net
