TNT vs Fox

TNT vs Fox

After the race at Pocono, I was reminded why I like the Fox coverage sooooo
much better than TNT. The camera angles and the commentators are so much
better on Fox. And, I agree with pig.... I miss boogity, boogity, boogity.

I sure hope ABC is better than TNT.

Mike

Re: TNT vs Fox

I was disappointed, because TNT usually is second best to Fox and way ahead
of ESPN/ABC......but the number of technical glitches was rather surprising
to me, many of them in the audio department.

Not only losing sound entirely, but cutting in some baseball game instead of
the race, and then later on they cut in something else, I don't recall or
couldn't identify what. And they repeatedly cut to commercial while one or
another of the commentators was in midsentence.

Some tech stuff can't be helped, but the accumulation of tech problems on
this one added up to a broadcast that felt *amateur*. I have no problem
with a broadcaster having a style I like less than I do someone else's, but
I do expect a technically professional production....

Hopefully they'll quickly eradicate the first week bugs. Hopefully.

--pig


On 6/8/08 10:06 PM, in article 65OdnQI64ZScH9HVnZ2dnUVZ_rzinZ2d@posted.yhti,
"Mike Simmons" <mikesim@yhti,net > wrote:

> After the race at Pocono, I was reminded why I like the Fox coverage sooooo
> much better than TNT. The camera angles and the commentators are so much
> better on Fox. And, I agree with pig.... I miss boogity, boogity, boogity.
>
> I sure hope ABC is better than TNT.
>
> Mike
>
>

Re: TNT vs Fox

FOX ran alot of commercials, but no where near the amount that TNT ran. We
didn't see much of the race today. Just alot of commercials in which the
volume is 3X louder than the race.

"Mike Simmons" <mikesim@yhti,net > wrote in message
news:65OdnQI64ZScH9HVnZ2dnUVZ_rzinZ2d@posted.yhti...
> After the race at Pocono, I was reminded why I like the Fox coverage
sooooo
> much better than TNT. The camera angles and the commentators are so much
> better on Fox. And, I agree with pig.... I miss boogity, boogity,
boogity.
>
> I sure hope ABC is better than TNT.
>
> Mike
>
>

Re: TNT vs Fox

On Jun 8, 10:31 pm, "dcp" <hous...@earthlink,net > wrote:
> FOX ran alot of commercials, but no where near the amount that TNT ran. We
> didn't see much of the race today. Just alot of commercials in which the
> volume is 3X louder than the race.
>
> "Mike Simmons" <mike...@yhti,net > wrote in message
>
> news:65OdnQI64ZScH9HVnZ2dnUVZ rzinZ2d@posted.yhti...
>
>
>
> > After the race at Pocono, I was reminded why I like the Fox coverage
> sooooo
> > much better than TNT.  The camera angles and the commentators are so much
> > better on Fox.  And, I agree with pig.... I miss boogity, boogity,
> boogity.
>
> > I sure hope ABC is better than TNT.
>
> > Mike- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Nearly all the commercials were at an ordinary volume of sound - TNT
was absolutely below normal volume. I had to turn the sound up while
they showed the race, and then down during the commercials.

Usually, it's only one advertiser among many that is too loud (Sirius
- way too loud) - but in this case, it was TNT not being loud enough.
It was very annoying.

N.

Re: TNT vs Fox

Nancy2 <nancy-dooley@uiowa.edu> wrote in
news:ec7e3d8c-0896-4162-bb4e-d28aec8bffd9@t54g2000hsg.googlegroups,com :

> Nearly all the commercials were at an ordinary volume of sound - TNT
> was absolutely below normal volume. I had to turn the sound up while
> they showed the race, and then down during the commercials.

That's not too unusual on cable, unfortunately. The FCC regulates
commercial volume on broadcast TV (e.g. Fox) (not that the FCC
really gives a d**n about it), but the cable networks are free to
try and make commercials more intrusive if they want to.

John

Re: TNT vs Fox


"John McCoy" <igopogo@ix,net com,com > wrote in message
news:Xns9AB8CAC4653F8pogosupernews@216.168.3.30...
> Nancy2 <nancy-dooley@uiowa.edu> wrote in
> news:ec7e3d8c-0896-4162-bb4e-d28aec8bffd9@t54g2000hsg.googlegroups,com :
>
>> Nearly all the commercials were at an ordinary volume of sound - TNT
>> was absolutely below normal volume. I had to turn the sound up while
>> they showed the race, and then down during the commercials.
>
> That's not too unusual on cable, unfortunately. The FCC regulates
> commercial volume on broadcast TV (e.g. Fox) (not that the FCC
> really gives a d**n about it), but the cable networks are free to
> try and make commercials more intrusive if they want to.
>
> John

I noticed the same thing on DirecTV. I assume they are unregulated as well?

Mike

>

Re: TNT vs Fox

On Jun 9, 10:59 pm, "Mike Simmons" <mike...@yhti,net > wrote:
> "John McCoy" <igop...@ix,net com,com > wrote in message
>
> news:Xns9AB8CAC4653F8pogosupernews@216.168.3.30...
>
> > Nancy2 <nancy-doo...@uiowa.edu> wrote in
> >news:ec7e3d8c-0896-4162-bb4e-d28aec8bffd9@t54g2000hsg.googlegroups,com :
>
> >> Nearly all the commercials were at an ordinary volume of sound - TNT
> >> was absolutely below normal volume.  I had to turn the sound up while
> >> they showed the race, and then down during the commercials.
>
> > That's not too unusual on cable, unfortunately.  The FCC regulates
> > commercial volume on broadcast TV (e.g. Fox) (not that the FCC
> > really gives a d**n about it), but the cable networks are free to
> > try and make commercials more intrusive if they want to.
>
> > John
>
> I noticed the same thing on DirecTV.  I assume they are unregulated as well?
>
> Mike
>
>
>
> - Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

I believe the NBC networks (NBC itself, plus TNT, at least) are having
audio feed problems. Last night, my local NBC station's sound was so
faint, I couldn't really hear any words until I turned the volume up
about as high as it would go - all other local channels AND cable
channels (except TNT) were then so loud they could be heard 2 blocks
away. The NBC stations were the only ones with the really faint
audio. I queried DTV this morning, along with my local NBC to see
what's going on.

This is markedly different than the usual "commercials are always
louder" phenom.

It was the same experience with DTV, and also with my roof antenna
only. No other channels are experiencing this audio problem.

N.

Re: TNT vs Fox

On Jun 10, 11:16 am, Nancy2 <nancy-doo...@uiowa.edu> wrote:
> On Jun 9, 10:59 pm, "Mike Simmons" <mike...@yhti,net > wrote:
>
>
>
> > "John McCoy" <igop...@ix,net com,com > wrote in message
>
> >news:Xns9AB8CAC4653F8pogosupernews@216.168.3.30...
>
> > > Nancy2 <nancy-doo...@uiowa.edu> wrote in
> > >news:ec7e3d8c-0896-4162-bb4e-d28aec8bffd9@t54g2000hsg.googlegroups,com :
>
> > >> Nearly all the commercials were at an ordinary volume of sound - TNT
> > >> was absolutely below normal volume. I had to turn the sound up while
> > >> they showed the race, and then down during the commercials.
>
> > > That's not too unusual on cable, unfortunately. The FCC regulates
> > > commercial volume on broadcast TV (e.g. Fox) (not that the FCC
> > > really gives a d**n about it), but the cable networks are free to
> > > try and make commercials more intrusive if they want to.
>
> > > John
>
> > I noticed the same thing on DirecTV. I assume they are unregulated as well?
>
> > Mike
>
> > - Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> I believe the NBC networks (NBC itself, plus TNT, at least) are having
> audio feed problems. Last night, my local NBC station's sound was so
> faint, I couldn't really hear any words until I turned the volume up
> about as high as it would go - all other local channels AND cable
> channels (except TNT) were then so loud they could be heard 2 blocks
> away. The NBC stations were the only ones with the really faint
> audio. I queried DTV this morning, along with my local NBC to see
> what's going on.
>
> This is markedly different than the usual "commercials are always
> louder" phenom.
>
> It was the same experience with DTV, and also with my roof antenna
> only. No other channels are experiencing this audio problem.
>
> N.

Well, my local NBC station finally ponied up and fixed the volume on
their broadcast; TNT is marginally better now than it was Sunday. I
hope it stays at least as loud as it is now, from now on.

N.

Re: TNT vs Fox

"Mike Simmons" <mikesim@yhti,net > wrote in
news:0YqdnSfYvd-Uc9DVnZ2dnUVZ_gmdnZ2d@posted.yhti:

>
> "John McCoy" <igopogo@ix,net com,com > wrote in message
> news:Xns9AB8CAC4653F8pogosupernews@216.168.3.30...

>> That's not too unusual on cable, unfortunately. The FCC regulates
>> commercial volume on broadcast TV (e.g. Fox) (not that the FCC
>> really gives a d**n about it), but the cable networks are free to
>> try and make commercials more intrusive if they want to.

> I noticed the same thing on DirecTV. I assume they are unregulated as
> well?

The general answer is yes. Regular broadcast (VHF & UHF channels)
has regulations on audio levels for technical reasons (so they
don't overmodulate and splatter the adjacent channel, if you
want details :-) That doesn't apply to either cable or satelite
TV, or to tape/DVD for that matter.

It sounds from what Nancy said, tho, that this was abnormal, and
not the usual playing with commercial loudness.

John

Re: TNT vs Fox

On Tue, 10 Jun 2008 20:33:57 CST, John McCoy <igopogo@ix,net com,com > wrote in <Xns9AB9DBAD15F9pogosupernews@216.168.3.30>:

> ... Regular broadcast (VHF & UHF channels)
>has regulations on audio levels for technical reasons (so they
>don't overmodulate and splatter the adjacent channel, if you
>want details :-) That doesn't apply to either cable or satelite
>TV, or to tape/DVD for that matter.

I've heard different reasons for the perception that
the commercials are louder.

Here's one set of speculations:

http :// www .msnbc.msn,com /id/17229281/

I've also heard that they focus on the most easily
heard part of the audio range so that the perceived
volume is louder than that registered on a decibel
meter, which covers the whole sound spectrum.

I would guess that no one produces "made for cable
commercials"--in the sense of remixing the sound
levels to make the less regulated arena more irritating
than over-the-air broadcasts. My guess is that there
are other factors in the mix (local feed for commercial
vs. national feed?).

Marty
--
Big-8 newsgroups: humanities.*, misc.*, news.*, rec.*, sci.*, soc.*, talk.*
See http :// www .big-8.org for info on how to add or remove newsgroups.

Re: TNT vs Fox

It does seem to be often a case of the cable/satellite company cranking the
volume when it kicks over to their side. It's tempting to say "okay, maybe
it's a new guy, maybe he's clueless" when this is the case, but when it
happens day after day after week after week, it becomes apparent that it's
intentional on their part. Arguments for doing this intentionally seem to
range from "well, you're making sure they can hear about the product from
the kitchen/bathroom" to "it's going to make them pay attention, whether
it's to flinch or mute or what----and if they mute the commercial, then they
HAVE to watch it to see when it ends and their show is back."

OTOH, when it's a single event, could be there's some cluelessness in the
mix. As to the source, Occam suggests that there's one piece of the puzzle
that needs looking at: of the folks who heard the obnoxiously loud
commercials, what was your source for TNT?

Mine was dishTV. I would argue that if the answers all come back "dishTV",
then yes, it was dish's local stuff messing up. But if the answers come
back "direcTV" "Comcast" etc., etc., then it was on TNT's end. The odds
that a handful of cable and satellite companies would ALL suddenly crank the
volume to painful on the same race boggles the imagination.

--pig


On 6/11/08 09:47, in article 4LydnaR4xprAxNLVnZ2dnUVZ_gOdnZ2d@supernews,com ,
"Martin X. Moleski, SJ" <moleski@canisius.edu> wrote:

> I would guess that no one produces "made for cable
> commercials"--in the sense of remixing the sound
> levels to make the less regulated arena more irritating
> than over-the-air broadcasts. My guess is that there
> are other factors in the mix (local feed for commercial
> vs. national feed?).

Re: TNT vs Fox

"Martin X. Moleski, SJ" <moleski@canisius.edu> wrote in
news:4LydnaR4xprAxNLVnZ2dnUVZ_gOdnZ2d@supernews,com :


> I've heard different reasons for the perception that
> the commercials are louder.
>
> Here's one set of speculations:
>
> http :// www .msnbc.msn,com /id/17229281/

Not speculation, that's exactly the reason. There's no mystery
there.

John

Re: TNT vs Fox

On Wed, 11 Jun 2008 20:16:22 CST, John McCoy <igopogo@ix,net com,com > wrote in
<Xns9ABAD56F1155Bpogosupernews@216.168.3.30>:

>"Martin X. Moleski, SJ" <moleski@canisius.edu> wrote in
>news:4LydnaR4xprAxNLVnZ2dnUVZ_gOdnZ2d@supernews,com :

>> I've heard different reasons for the perception that
>> the commercials are louder.

>> Here's one set of speculations:

>> http :// www .msnbc.msn,com /id/17229281/

>Not speculation, that's exactly the reason. There's no mystery
>there.

OK.

I don't feel qualified to judge between theories myself.
I'll take your word for it. ;o)

Marty

Re: TNT vs Fox

"Martin X. Moleski, SJ" <moleski@canisius.edu> wrote in
news:v7a154tl8f66ltk69lfkocv8tno3p599p2@4ax,com :

> On Wed, 11 Jun 2008 20:16:22 CST, John McCoy <igopogo@ix,net com,com >
> wrote in <Xns9ABAD56F1155Bpogosupernews@216.168.3.30>:
>
>>"Martin X. Moleski, SJ" <moleski@canisius.edu> wrote in
>>news:4LydnaR4xprAxNLVnZ2dnUVZ_gOdnZ2d@supernews,com :
>
>>> I've heard different reasons for the perception that
>>> the commercials are louder.
>
>>> Here's one set of speculations:
>
>>> http :// www .msnbc.msn,com /id/17229281/
>
>>Not speculation, that's exactly the reason. There's no mystery
>>there.
>
> OK.
>
> I don't feel qualified to judge between theories myself.
> I'll take your word for it. ;o)

My Dad was in the broadcast industry his whole working life
(designing broadcast equipment). He was well aware of how
tricks like that worked - and very displeased by it, since
it was both annoying and in his mind unethical.

John

Re: TNT vs Fox

The thing is, what I was experiencing on race day was *not* "these
particular commercials happen to be loud" (Were that the case, every
commercial for Flootie's Flippers, for example, would be obnoxiously loud,
on every network, with every broadcast/cable/satellite provider.)

And what I'm finding is that is NOT true. Often it *is* the "local" (cable
company provided) commercials as opposed to network commercials, and often
they're the same commercials the networks run---but they're not loud when
the networks run them.

I'm talking your ears are actually in physical PAIN loud. Not "that's
irritating", but "that HURTS."

It's very rare that it's done by a network, but apparently in this race, it
was. Added to their other audio problems and the timing (early June), part
of me wonders if at least part of the mix wasn't an intern or two or three,
fresh out of college.......no way of knowing, of course, but especially if
all those problems disappear at Michigan, suspicious.

--pig


On 6/12/08 21:32, in article Xns9ABBC3CADD9C1pogosupernews@216.168.3.30,
"John McCoy" <igopogo@ix,net com,com > wrote:

> My Dad was in the broadcast industry his whole working life
> (designing broadcast equipment). He was well aware of how
> tricks like that worked - and very displeased by it, since
> it was both annoying and in his mind unethical.