Simmons - RPG - Daytona II - 2/10, plus scoring ?

Simmons - RPG - Daytona II - 2/10, plus scoring ?

An exciting race to be sure, but not how I expected it to end. I guess I
(along with Cousin Carl) will always wonder what woulda happened had the
last wreck not occurred.... oh well.....

Earnhardt - 0
Stewart - 0
Ky Busch - 1
Hamlin - 0
Ku Busch - 1

...and the winner is.... Ku Busch (wrong Busch!)

For funsies the top rookie is Carpentier can I call 'em or can I call em?
Too bad it wuz just fer funsies... I guess I can claim a few MV points
tho'...

Also, if I went strictly by my gut, I would have put Mark Martin in the top
five so we shall see. My gut wasn't too far off, he ran well all night.


The outcome brings me to a question for the scoring guru's though. You will
note that I picked Smoke as part of my top five. He bailed due to the flu
and Yeley stepped in for him. If Yeley would have been scored in the top
five, would I have been entitled to a point? Has this happened in an RPG
before? No biggie since it didn't happen but I am curious as to what we
would do.

Happy Independence Day to one and all. God Bless those who are serving us
and God Bless the USA!

Let the games begin!

Mike

Re: Simmons - RPG - Daytona II - 2/10, plus scoring ?

On Sun, 6 Jul 2008 08:29:24 CST, "Mike Simmons" <mikesim@yhti,net >
wrote:

<snip>
>
>The outcome brings me to a question for the scoring guru's though. You will
>note that I picked Smoke as part of my top five. He bailed due to the flu
>and Yeley stepped in for him. If Yeley would have been scored in the top
>five, would I have been entitled to a point? Has this happened in an RPG
>before? No biggie since it didn't happen but I am curious as to what we
>would do.
>
It's just my opinion, but I would think you could have claimed it.
Smoke got the points since he started the race.

It was a heck of a run by Yeley though. The Home Depot said they
would be happy if he finished in the top 15. He was well into the top
15 (I think he even cracked the top 10) then he got caught up in other
peoples madness. Still, 20th ain't bad for a substitute driver.

Tom S.

Re: Simmons - RPG - Daytona II - 2/10, plus scoring ?


"Tom S." <tscalfjr@cox,net > wrote in message
news:pcl1741bcuggaedpn1i54a6scdvnk2d0kt@4ax,com ...
> On Sun, 6 Jul 2008 08:29:24 CST, "Mike Simmons" <mikesim@yhti,net >
> wrote:
>
> <snip>
>>
>>The outcome brings me to a question for the scoring guru's though. You
>>will
>>note that I picked Smoke as part of my top five. He bailed due to the flu
>>and Yeley stepped in for him. If Yeley would have been scored in the top
>>five, would I have been entitled to a point? Has this happened in an RPG
>>before? No biggie since it didn't happen but I am curious as to what we
>>would do.
>>
> It's just my opinion, but I would think you could have claimed it.
> Smoke got the points since he started the race.
>
> It was a heck of a run by Yeley though. The Home Depot said they
> would be happy if he finished in the top 15. He was well into the top
> 15 (I think he even cracked the top 10) then he got caught up in other
> peoples madness. Still, 20th ain't bad for a substitute driver.
>
> Tom S.

You're right, he was impressive. It is kind of illuminating to see how he
can drive when he is in the "good stuff".

Mike

>

Re: Simmons - RPG - Daytona II - 2/10, plus scoring ?

"Mike Simmons" <mikesim@yhti,net > wrote in
news:JqOdnc4n_pJQfe3VnZ2dnUVZ_u-dnZ2d@posted.yhti:

>
> "Tom S." <tscalfjr@cox,net > wrote in message
> news:pcl1741bcuggaedpn1i54a6scdvnk2d0kt@4ax,com ...

>> It was a heck of a run by Yeley though. The Home Depot said they
>> would be happy if he finished in the top 15. He was well into the
>> top 15 (I think he even cracked the top 10) then he got caught up in
>> other peoples madness. Still, 20th ain't bad for a substitute
>> driver.
>>
> You're right, he was impressive. It is kind of illuminating to see
> how he can drive when he is in the "good stuff".

Uh, wait a minit. That's the same "good stuff" he had in 2006 and
2007, and he didn't do much of anything with it then.

I'm more inclined to think it shows how little talent counts as
far as getting a good finish in a plate race. If the car doesn't
break, it's mostly just luck of the draft and the pitstops.

John

Re: Simmons - RPG - Daytona II - 2/10, plus scoring ?

"Mike Simmons" <mikesim@yhti,net > wrote in
news:wNqdnSQ4Veo5Ou3VnZ2dnUVZ_jOdnZ2d@posted.yhti:

> The outcome brings me to a question for the scoring guru's though.
> You will note that I picked Smoke as part of my top five. He bailed
> due to the flu and Yeley stepped in for him. If Yeley would have been
> scored in the top five, would I have been entitled to a point? Has
> this happened in an RPG before? No biggie since it didn't happen but
> I am curious as to what we would do.

Never has happened. If it did, I'm sure we'd argue about it
for at least a couple of weeks.

In my opinion, you wouldn't get the point. If you picked Stewart
to finish T5, and he didn't finish, then he didn't finish in the
T5. The fact that someone else finished T5 in the same car would
not affect it - in my mind it's the same as if someone else had
driven the car the whole race, where you clearly wouldn't score
a point.

John

Re: Simmons - RPG - Daytona II - 2/10, plus scoring ?

On Sun, 6 Jul 2008 14:39:56 CST, John McCoy <igopogo@ix,net com,com > wrote in <Xns9AD39DC64229Cpogosupernews@216.168.3.30>:

>"Mike Simmons" <mikesim@yhti,net > wrote in
>news:wNqdnSQ4Veo5Ou3VnZ2dnUVZ jOdnZ2d@posted.yhti:

>> The outcome brings me to a question for the scoring guru's though.
>> You will note that I picked Smoke as part of my top five. He bailed
>> due to the flu and Yeley stepped in for him. If Yeley would have been
>> scored in the top five, would I have been entitled to a point? Has
>> this happened in an RPG before? No biggie since it didn't happen but
>> I am curious as to what we would do.

>Never has happened. If it did, I'm sure we'd argue about it
>for at least a couple of weeks.

>In my opinion, you wouldn't get the point. If you picked Stewart
>to finish T5, and he didn't finish, then he didn't finish in the
>T5. The fact that someone else finished T5 in the same car would
>not affect it - in my mind it's the same as if someone else had
>driven the car the whole race, where you clearly wouldn't score
>a point.

There's nothing in the rules (yet) about this case.

We do have this provision to cover situations not
covered by the rules:

25. Any contestant may attempt to convene a Kangaroo court to
settle disputes.

1. The person who wants the points is the “defendant.”
2. Those who are opposed to giving points are the “prosecution.”
3. Decisions on BD appeals will be made by vote of those who have
played RPG up to that point in the season.
4. In the case of tied votes, the person who called for the Court
loses the trial.

The court is NOT in session because no points are at
stake, unless, course, enough people want to settle
the question now so that we'll know what to do in
the future.

FWIW, my inclination would be to give the point. :o)

Marty
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Re: Simmons - RPG - Daytona II - 2/10, plus scoring ?




On 7/7/08 6:10 PM, in article
beSdne7JUabUG-_VnZ2dnUVZ_s7inZ2d@supernews,com , "Martin X. Moleski, SJ"
<moleski@canisius.edu> wrote:

<snipped>

> FWIW, my inclination would be to give the point. :o)
>
> Marty

Now what about the *other* case?

Let us posit that Tony Stewart starts the race in the 20; Kyle Busch starts
the race in the 18.

Let us further posit that on lap 35, the 20 is wrecked beyond possibility of
returning to the track. For some unlikely reason, Smoke doesn't hop the jet
back to Columbus almost immediately, but stays at the track.

Meanwhile, back at the ranch, Rowdy's got the flu. On lap 85, he says
"sorry, can't do it" and they put Smoke into the 18.

Smoke brings the 18 into Victory Lane.

As it happens, Simmons has, as one of his picks, said "Tony Stewart will win
the race." McCoy has said "Kyle Busch will win the race."

Do they both get the points, since it's Smoke driving, but Rowdy's car? Or
does only one of them get the points? Or neither?

My vote would go toward "both do": picking a driver is generally presumed to
mean that driver's car, but that's a presumption, which makes it difficult
to argue that "the driver you said would win actually drove the winning car
across the line, so you're wrong" under any circumstances.

Waddaya think?

--pig

Re: Simmons - RPG - Daytona II - 2/10, plus scoring ?

On Mon, 7 Jul 2008 18:49:48 CST, Megan Zurawicz <listpig@sbcglobal,net > wrote in <C49823C2.4373%listpig@sbcglobal,net >:

> ... Do they both get the points, since it's Smoke driving, but Rowdy's car? Or
>does only one of them get the points? Or neither?

>My vote would go toward "both do": picking a driver is generally presumed to
>mean that driver's car, but that's a presumption, which makes it difficult
>to argue that "the driver you said would win actually drove the winning car
>across the line, so you're wrong" under any circumstances.

>Waddaya think?

I'd give points all around.

If that creates an RPG tie, it will have to be
settled on other grounds. :o)

Marty
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Re: Simmons - RPG - Daytona II - 2/10, plus scoring ?

Megan Zurawicz <listpig@sbcglobal,net > wrote in
news:C49823C2.4373%listpig@sbcglobal,net :

> As it happens, Simmons has, as one of his picks, said "Tony Stewart
> will win the race." McCoy has said "Kyle Busch will win the race."
>
> Do they both get the points, since it's Smoke driving, but Rowdy's
> car? Or does only one of them get the points? Or neither?

I'd say Mike does, and I don't. If I'd said "the 18 car will win",
then I'd get points. But as you say, we typically don't pick that
way.

> My vote would go toward "both do"

You have a noble & generous spirit :-)

John

Re: Simmons - RPG - Daytona II - 2/10, plus scoring ?


"Megan Zurawicz" <listpig@sbcglobal,net > wrote in message
news:C49823C2.4373%listpig@sbcglobal,net ...
>
>
>
> On 7/7/08 6:10 PM, in article
> beSdne7JUabUG-_VnZ2dnUVZ_s7inZ2d@supernews,com , "Martin X. Moleski, SJ"
> <moleski@canisius.edu> wrote:
>
> <snipped>
>
>> FWIW, my inclination would be to give the point. :o)
>>
>> Marty
>
> Now what about the *other* case?
>
> Let us posit that Tony Stewart starts the race in the 20; Kyle Busch
> starts
> the race in the 18.
>
> Let us further posit that on lap 35, the 20 is wrecked beyond possibility
> of
> returning to the track. For some unlikely reason, Smoke doesn't hop the
> jet
> back to Columbus almost immediately, but stays at the track.
>
> Meanwhile, back at the ranch, Rowdy's got the flu. On lap 85, he says
> "sorry, can't do it" and they put Smoke into the 18.
>
> Smoke brings the 18 into Victory Lane.
>
> As it happens, Simmons has, as one of his picks, said "Tony Stewart will
> win
> the race." McCoy has said "Kyle Busch will win the race."
>
> Do they both get the points, since it's Smoke driving, but Rowdy's car?
> Or
> does only one of them get the points? Or neither?
>
> My vote would go toward "both do": picking a driver is generally presumed
> to
> mean that driver's car, but that's a presumption, which makes it difficult
> to argue that "the driver you said would win actually drove the winning
> car
> across the line, so you're wrong" under any circumstances.
>
> Waddaya think?
>
> --pig

Good point, pig. Highly unlikely, but yet possible. I think to simplify
the rules, we should say that in the event of something like this, the car
is the "presumed" pick and points are awarded accordingly. Howzzat sound?

Mike

>

Re: Simmons - RPG - Daytona II - 2/10, plus scoring ?

On Mon, 7 Jul 2008 22:02:19 CST, "Mike Simmons" <mikesim@yhti,net > wrote in <NdydncwTgco2Re_VnZ2dnUVZ_g-dnZ2d@posted.yhti>:

> ... I think to simplify
>the rules, we should say that in the event of something like this, the car
>is the "presumed" pick and points are awarded accordingly.

You cannot add new rules and claim to be "simplifying" at the
same time. We have 26 rules now and 6 precepts of the game.

I'm not opposed to making new rules, of course, That's how
we got so many in the first place! :o)

Marty
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Re: Simmons - RPG - Daytona II - 2/10, plus scoring ?


"Martin X. Moleski, SJ" <moleski@canisius.edu> wrote in message
news:ssKdnYTdApEdYu_VnZ2dnUVZ_gOdnZ2d@supernews,com ...
> On Mon, 7 Jul 2008 22:02:19 CST, "Mike Simmons" <mikesim@yhti,net > wrote
> in <NdydncwTgco2Re_VnZ2dnUVZ_g-dnZ2d@posted.yhti>:
>
>> ... I think to simplify
>>the rules, we should say that in the event of something like this, the car
>>is the "presumed" pick and points are awarded accordingly.
>
> You cannot add new rules and claim to be "simplifying" at the
> same time. We have 26 rules now and 6 precepts of the game.
>
> I'm not opposed to making new rules, of course, That's how
> we got so many in the first place! :o)
>
> Marty

You are, of course, correct. I guess I have been paying to much attention
to the political scene where both candidates are promising to "simplify" our
lives (not!) if elected. I suspect that "clarify" would have been a better
choice of words.

I guess the kangaroo court option where we bitch amongst ourselves does add
a little spice the the otherwise staid group, doesn't it?

Mike

Re: Simmons - RPG - Daytona II - 2/10, plus scoring ?

On Tue, 8 Jul 2008 09:45:59 CST, "Mike Simmons" <mikesim@yhti,net > wrote in <4ZednRPkK4C54O7VnZ2dnUVZ_rmdnZ2d@posted.yhti>:

> ... I guess the kangaroo court option where we bitch amongst ourselves does add
>a little spice the the otherwise staid group, doesn't it?

It does for me.

Tastes vary, of course. There are some people
who don't enjoy arguing about rules and the
intepretation of rules. For them, all the good
stuff happens between the green and the checkered
flags. :o)

Marty
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Re: Simmons - RPG - Daytona II - 2/10, plus scoring ?

"Martin X. Moleski, SJ" <moleski@canisius.edu> wrote in
news:ssKdnYTdApEdYu_VnZ2dnUVZ_gOdnZ2d@supernews,com :

> You cannot add new rules and claim to be "simplifying" at the
> same time. We have 26 rules now and 6 precepts of the game.
>
> I'm not opposed to making new rules, of course, That's how
> we got so many in the first place! :o)

Hmmm, I beleive that to pass judgement on the rules, you have
to play the game...

Better get Mr Random out of retirement :-)

John

Re: Simmons - RPG - Daytona II - 2/10, plus scoring ?

On Tue, 8 Jul 2008 17:49:33 CST, John McCoy <igopogo@ix,net com,com > wrote in <Xns9AD5B9E2E8C9Cpogosupernews@216.168.3.30>:

>> I'm not opposed to making new rules, of course, That's how
>> we got so many in the first place! :o)

>Hmmm, I beleive that to pass judgment on the rules, you have
>to play the game...

That rule applies to ordinary mortals.

Rule #1 is "The Benevolent Dictator (BD) makes all the rules."
You can look it up:

http :// moleski,net /dokuwiki/doku.php/rasnm/rpg

>Better get Mr Random out of retirement :-)

We've got 13 points on the season, if I remember correctly.
That's the best we've ever done. I see no harm in sitting
on our laurels. ;o)

Marty
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