introductory high end audio buying guide

introductory high end audio buying guide

Hi
I have owned a bose system for several years and I am finally
beginning to feel that I am growing out of it. Its good for home
theater but doesnt give me the *full* sound that I expect for music.
Anyway, I am looking at spending some money to buy a nice stereo
system (a good pair of speaker, an amp and maybe a pre-amp). Can
anyone recommend me to a book or a set of articles which walk you
through some technicals and some suggestions on how to go about
picking stuff. My budget is upto about 5k altho if I can find
something for less than 3k, its better :)

Thanks

- Rajeev

Re: introductory high end audio buying guide

bector.online@gmail . com wrote:
> Hi
> I have owned a bose system for several years and I am finally
> beginning to feel that I am growing out of it. Its good for home
> theater but doesnt give me the *full* sound that I expect for music.
> Anyway, I am looking at spending some money to buy a nice stereo
> system (a good pair of speaker, an amp and maybe a pre-amp). Can
> anyone recommend me to a book or a set of articles which walk you
> through some technicals and some suggestions on how to go about
> picking stuff. My budget is upto about 5k altho if I can find
> something for less than 3k, its better :)
>
> Thanks
>
> - Rajeev

Read Absolute Sound when it comes out.

Re: introductory high end audio buying guide

On May 4, 10:49 pm, Peter Elem <pe...@optimum . net > wrote:

> Read Absolute Sound when it comes out.

And whatever it says, assume the opposite. Ditto for the editor's
book.

Here's a site with a much higher signal-to-noise ratio: * w w w .audioholics . com /

bob

Re: introductory high end audio buying guide

"Peter Elem" <pelem@optimum . net > wrote in message
news:fvlsjv017hc@news1.newsguy . com
> bector.online@gmail . com wrote:
>> Hi
>> I have owned a bose system for several years and I am
>> finally beginning to feel that I am growing out of it.
>> Its good for home theater but doesnt give me the *full*
>> sound that I expect for music. Anyway, I am looking at
>> spending some money to buy a nice stereo system (a good
>> pair of speaker, an amp and maybe a pre-amp). Can anyone
>> recommend me to a book or a set of articles which walk
>> you through some technicals and some suggestions on how
>> to go about picking stuff. My budget is upto about 5k
>> altho if I can find something for less than 3k, its
>> better :) Thanks
>>
>> - Rajeev
>
> Read Absolute Sound when it comes out.

....Then invert the meaning of just about every word you read. IOW if TAS
says water flows downhill, run do not walk to your kitchen sink and do your
own test, because they generally don't get anything right.

Re: introductory high end audio buying guide

In rec.audio.high-end, bector.online@gmail . com had the audacity to say that:

> Hi
> I have owned a bose system for several years and I am finally
> beginning to feel that I am growing out of it. Its good for home
> theater but doesnt give me the *full* sound that I expect for music.
> Anyway, I am looking at spending some money to buy a nice stereo
> system (a good pair of speaker, an amp and maybe a pre-amp). Can
> anyone recommend me to a book or a set of articles which walk you
> through some technicals and some suggestions on how to go about
> picking stuff. My budget is upto about 5k altho if I can find
> something for less than 3k, its better :)
>
> Thanks
>
> - Rajeev

This book is pretty thorough, covers alot of ground, but the author comes
across as an elitist, boorish snob.

* w w w .amazon . com /gp/product/0964084945

*R* *H*

--
"For me, prayer is a surge of the heart; it is a simple look turned toward
heaven, it is a cry of recognition and of love, embracing both trial and
joy." - Saint Therese of Lisieux

Re: introductory high end audio buying guide

On May 4, 3:31 pm, bector.onl...@gmail . com wrote:
> Hi
>  I have owned a bose system for several years and I am finally
> beginning to feel that I am growing out of it. Its good for home
> theater but doesnt give me the *full* sound that I expect for music.
> Anyway, I am looking at spending some money to buy a nice stereo
> system (a good pair of speaker, an amp and maybe a pre-amp). Can
> anyone recommend me to a book or a set of articles which walk you
> through some technicals and some suggestions on how to go about
> picking stuff. My budget is upto about 5k altho if I can find
> something for less than 3k, its better :)
>
> Thanks
>
> - Rajeev

With due respect and some humor, if your point of departure is a Bose
system, nearly anything you do will sound better.

All that aside, there are reams of literature, thousands of articles,
and vast amounts of information out there that all lead up to the same
thing:

Audition
Audition
Audition

You are anticipating spending what many people spend on a used car, in
some parts of the world a brand new car. For that kind of money, you
should be able to demand a good level of cooperation from sellers and
dealers.

Legends to avoid:

a) It depends on what you listen to - No, it does not. A good system
will be capable of reproducing anything thrown at it irrespective of
style and origin. Some systems *are not* capable of such resilience,
but do well on restricted signal. Not much good if you want to listen
outside of that range.

b) It depends on the volume you listen at - No, not really. A good
system has sufficient headroom to reproduce signal at any reasonable
volume. Yes, your listening conditions will affect what is a
'reasonable volume', but that is simply another operating condition
that must be met. Again, some systems do well at low volumes with
restricted signals... not much good as above.

c) Expensive = Better Sound - Moving target. Not necessarily. More so
with speakers, turntables, cartridges and various transducers, far
less so with electronics-in-general, tuners, pre-amps and power amps.

d) Tubes are better than Solid State - No, just different. And with
different limitations and peformance parameters.

e) Solid State is better than Tubes - As above.

Pick what you like, listen to it for an extended period of time in
your home environment. You CANNOT judge well except there. Try various
things. Don't just settle, and listen only to the equipment, not the
salesperson.

And good luck. There is more smoke, mirrors, persiflage and blather in
the "HiFi" industry than with used cars.

Peter Wieck
Melrose Park, PA

Re: introductory high end audio buying guide

Some good info on this page:
* w w w .harmanaudio . com /all about audio/

Including a good explanation of power specifications, and an overview
article on speaker design.

bob

Re: introductory high end audio buying guide

bob <nabob33@hotmail . com > writes:

> Some good info on this page:
> * w w w .harmanaudio . com /all_about_audio/
>
> Including a good explanation of power specifications, and an overview
> article on speaker design.
>
> bob

Also check out "Audio Perfectionist Journal;" the 1st 2 journals are
free and IMO, having bought all of them to date, contain the best
information.

* w w w .audioperfectionist . com /pages/freejournals.html

Re: introductory high end audio buying guide

Robert Sink <sinkr@spamcop . net > wrote:
> bob <nabob33@hotmail . com > writes:

> > Some good info on this page:
> > * w w w .harmanaudio . com /all_about_audio/
> >
> > Including a good explanation of power specifications, and an overview
> > article on speaker design.
> >
> > bob

> Also check out "Audio Perfectionist Journal;" the 1st 2 journals are
> free and IMO, having bought all of them to date, contain the best
> information.

> * w w w .audioperfectionist . com /pages/freejournals.html

does Hardesty *ever* employ blind comparisons?

--
-S
maybe they wanna rock.
maybe they need to rock.
Maybe it's for the money? But That's none of our business..our business as fans is to rock
with them.

Re: introductory high end audio buying guide

Steven Sullivan <ssully@panix . com > writes:

> Robert Sink <sinkr@spamcop . net > wrote:
>> bob <nabob33@hotmail . com > writes:
>
>> > Some good info on this page:
>> > * w w w .harmanaudio . com /all_about_audio/
>> >
>> > Including a good explanation of power specifications, and an overview
>> > article on speaker design.
>> >
>> > bob
>
>> Also check out "Audio Perfectionist Journal;" the 1st 2 journals are
>> free and IMO, having bought all of them to date, contain the best
>> information.
>
>> * w w w .audioperfectionist . com /pages/freejournals.html
>
> does Hardesty *ever* employ blind comparisons?
[...]

I don't really recall--it's been years since I read the journals and
to be honest, and I've posted here about this before, while he speaks
of saving one money, the stuff he recommends is ridiculous like
$10-20k biwired Audioquest Everest cables, among other things in that
same price range.

What helped me was just the basics of speaker placement, acoustics of
a room, being wary of trying to equalize out a room/system, and as well
time/phase-accurate speakers like Vandersteens, Thiels, and
Meadowlarks (now defunct, I understand).

Beyond that, I think he and Shane Buettner get a little "out there" on
what they recommend ($30k vinyl setups, etc.) and I've taken that with
a grain of salt, but like I say, the first two journals especially
helped me (someone with no knowledge of how measurements are taken
[and bastardized]) understand some key basics (or they seemed key to
me, anyhow).

Re: introductory high end audio buying guide

On May 10, 12:48 am, Robert Sink <si...@spamcop . net > wrote:
> Steven Sullivan <ssu...@panix . com > writes:

> > does Hardesty *ever* employ blind comparisons?
>
> I don't really recall--it's been years since I read the journals and
> to be honest, and I've posted here about this before, while he speaks
> of saving one money, the stuff he recommends is ridiculous like
> $10-20k biwired Audioquest Everest cables, among other things in that
> same price range.

On the basis of that single recommendation, I think we can conclude
that Hardesty *never* employs blind comparisons.

> What helped me was just the basics of speaker placement, acoustics of
> a room, being wary of trying to equalize out a room/system, and as well
> time/phase-accurate speakers like Vandersteens, Thiels, and
> Meadowlarks (now defunct, I understand).
>
> Beyond that, I think he and Shane Buettner get a little "out there" on
> what they recommend ($30k vinyl setups, etc.) and I've taken that with
> a grain of salt, but like I say, the first two journals especially
> helped me (someone with no knowledge of how measurements are taken
> [and bastardized]) understand some key basics (or they seemed key to
> me, anyhow).

I read his newsletter for the first year, before he hiked the price to
match the products he touts. It was an odd mix of solid, practical
information and the usual high-end voodoo.

bob

Re: introductory high end audio buying guide

bob <nabob33@hotmail . com > writes:

> On May 10, 12:48 am, Robert Sink <si...@spamcop . net > wrote:
>> Steven Sullivan <ssu...@panix . com > writes:
>
>> > does Hardesty *ever* employ blind comparisons?

[...]

> On the basis of that single recommendation, I think we can conclude
> that Hardesty *never* employs blind comparisons.

[...]

>
> I read his newsletter for the first year, before he hiked the price to
> match the products he touts. It was an odd mix of solid, practical
> information and the usual high-end voodoo.

[...]

Yes, I'm inclined to agree with you--I think you articulated in 1
small paragraph what I danced around saying in several emails.

Re: introductory high end audio buying guide

On Fri, 9 May 2008 21:48:13 -0700, Robert Sink wrote
(in article <g039ed01ssv@news4.newsguy . com >):

> Steven Sullivan <ssully@panix . com > writes:
>
>> Robert Sink <sinkr@spamcop . net > wrote:
>>> bob <nabob33@hotmail . com > writes:
>>
>>>> Some good info on this page:
>>>> * w w w .harmanaudio . com /all_about_audio/
>>>>
>>>> Including a good explanation of power specifications, and an overview
>>>> article on speaker design.
>>>>
>>>> bob
>>
>>> Also check out "Audio Perfectionist Journal;" the 1st 2 journals are
>>> free and IMO, having bought all of them to date, contain the best
>>> information.
>>
>>> * w w w .audioperfectionist . com /pages/freejournals.html
>>
>> does Hardesty *ever* employ blind comparisons?
> [...]
>
> I don't really recall--it's been years since I read the journals and
> to be honest, and I've posted here about this before, while he speaks
> of saving one money, the stuff he recommends is ridiculous like
> $10-20k biwired Audioquest Everest cables, among other things in that
> same price range.

Anybody who openly recommends expensive cables (as opposed to merely
acknowledging that such cables exist for the buying should one feel compelled
to do so) is suspect in my book.

> What helped me was just the basics of speaker placement, acoustics of
> a room, being wary of trying to equalize out a room/system, and as well
> time/phase-accurate speakers like Vandersteens, Thiels, and
> Meadowlarks (now defunct, I understand).
>
> Beyond that, I think he and Shane Buettner get a little "out there" on
> what they recommend ($30k vinyl setups, etc.) and I've taken that with
> a grain of salt, but like I say, the first two journals especially
> helped me (someone with no knowledge of how measurements are taken
> [and bastardized]) understand some key basics (or they seemed key to
> me, anyhow).

Vinyl setups is one place in audio where I believe that expensive rigs
actually do "dig" more out of a record groove than do cheaper setups (up to
some as yet undetermined point - at least for me). That's because, like
speakers, Record players are electromechanical in nature (I.E. transducers)
and every part of them contribute to the sound of the whole. That means that
attention to mechanical detail (like turntable bearings, platter resonance,
speed stability, arm bearings, arm geometry, and of course, cartridge quality
and matching to the arm, etc.) is all important. Precision costs money and
the best I've heard a record sound was on an acquaintance's Walker Proscenium
turntable carrying some exotic cartridge which cost more than a diamond of
similar weight and size! I've never heard such sound from a phonograph record
before (one of my own personal records to boot), it was eye opening. Now
whether or not that same (or at least similar) result could be had for a less
stratospheric price, I don't know. I do know that my J.A, Michell "Orbe"
Spyder/SME IV/Sumiko Blackbird combo doesn't even come close and it isn't
cheap kit by any stretch of the imagination!

Re: introductory high end audio buying guide

bector.online@gmail . com wrote:
> Hi
> I have owned a bose system for several years and I am finally
> beginning to feel that I am growing out of it. Its good for home
> theater but doesnt give me the *full* sound that I expect for music.
> Anyway, I am looking at spending some money to buy a nice stereo
> system (a good pair of speaker, an amp and maybe a pre-amp). Can
> anyone recommend me to a book or a set of articles which walk you
> through some technicals and some suggestions on how to go about
> picking stuff. My budget is upto about 5k altho if I can find
> something for less than 3k, its better :)

> Thanks

> - Rajeev

start by going here and spending $20 for a copy of the
2006 article by Floyd Toole, "Loudspeakers and Rooms for Sound Reproduction. A Scientific Review"

* w w w .aes.org/e-lib/browse.cfm?elib=13686

Don't bother with the clowns at Absolute Sound,
except as entertainment.

--
-S
maybe they wanna rock.
maybe they need to rock.
Maybe it's for the money? But That's none of our business..our business as fans is to rock
with them.

Re: introductory high end audio buying guide

Another good resource on speakers is the All About Sound brochure
from this page:
* w w w .paradigm . com /en/paradigm/downloads.php

Yes, it plugs one brand of speakers, but the technical information is
solid.

bob