Soldering switched TS jacks

Soldering switched TS jacks

Hey guys

I am trying to make this box on my wall. I think it is called a half
normaled patch bay:

* bgst.dk/box3.gif

It is supposed to work like this:
1) I plug a synth in the lower socket and it is connected to my
mixer.
2) I insert a cable in the top socket and the signal from my synth
runs through that cable and is disconnected from the mixer.

I believe this should be very simple to make but for some reason I
have problems. If I connect a cable in the top socket and remove it
agian I get hum and noise and the signal cuts out now and then. I'm
pretty sure it is not bad soldering and when I try a cable tester it
seems to work as is should.

I suspect the problem is related to how I soldered the switched jack
socket. Now it works by both disconnection both ground and hot when
inserting a jack in the top socket. Is this wrong? How is the correct
way to wire such a switched jack?

I would be very happy I could find out what is wrong, since this is
driving me nuts.

Bjarne

Re: Soldering switched TS jacks

Bjarne wrote:

> I am trying to make this box on my wall. I think it is called a half
> normaled patch bay:

Wire the jack pairs like this:

* w w w .soundonsound . com /sos/dec99/images/patchbay5.gif



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If you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring and reach
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Re: Soldering switched TS jacks

Bjarne <no@no.no> wrote:
>
>It is supposed to work like this:
>1) I plug a synth in the lower socket and it is connected to my
>mixer.
>2) I insert a cable in the top socket and the signal from my synth
>runs through that cable and is disconnected from the mixer.
>
>I believe this should be very simple to make but for some reason I
>have problems. If I connect a cable in the top socket and remove it
>agian I get hum and noise and the signal cuts out now and then. I'm
>pretty sure it is not bad soldering and when I try a cable tester it
>seems to work as is should.

What kind of connectors are you using? Long or short frame? Are they
nice Switchcraft ones or crappy Asian junk?

Are you using ONLY T-S cables going into T-S jacks? If you have short
frame plugs, are you using short frame cables?
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

Re: Soldering switched TS jacks

I've taken some pictures

* bgst.dk/socket1.jpg
* bgst.dk/socket2.jpg
* bgst.dk/socket3.jpg

The lower socket (synth) is NYS229
* w w w .neutrik . com /us/en/audio/210_1019408743/NYS229_detail.aspx

The top socket (switched) is NMJ4HC-S
* w w w .neutrik . com /us/en/industry/210_21541/NMJ4HC-S_detail.aspx

I've tried various cables for the connection to the sockets. Among
them standard neutrik NP2C connectors.

I've looked at the drawing Mike posted and to me it seems like I have
wired the sockets correctly. I could be wrong though, since my box is
a bit different (simpler).

Re: Soldering switched TS jacks

Bjarne wrote:
> I've taken some pictures
>
> * bgst.dk/socket1.jpg
> * bgst.dk/socket2.jpg
> * bgst.dk/socket3.jpg
>
> The lower socket (synth) is NYS229
> * w w w .neutrik . com /us/en/audio/210 1019408743/NYS229 detail.aspx
>
> The top socket (switched) is NMJ4HC-S
> * w w w .neutrik . com /us/en/industry/210 21541/NMJ4HC-S detail.aspx
>
> I've tried various cables for the connection to the sockets. Among
> them standard neutrik NP2C connectors.
>
> I've looked at the drawing Mike posted and to me it seems like I have
> wired the sockets correctly. I could be wrong though, since my box is
> a bit different (simpler).

Looking at socket 1, it seems that if you plug anything into the top
socket (recording device) it will only connect to the Synth in. The "To
Mixer" path becomes disconnected from everything. Is that what you wanted?

d

Re: Soldering switched TS jacks

Don Pearce wrote:
> Bjarne wrote:
>> I've taken some pictures
>>
>> * bgst.dk/socket1.jpg
>> * bgst.dk/socket2.jpg
>> * bgst.dk/socket3.jpg
>>
>> The lower socket (synth) is NYS229
>> * w w w .neutrik . com /us/en/audio/210 1019408743/NYS229 detail.aspx
>>
>> The top socket (switched) is NMJ4HC-S
>> * w w w .neutrik . com /us/en/industry/210 21541/NMJ4HC-S detail.aspx
>>
>> I've tried various cables for the connection to the sockets. Among
>> them standard neutrik NP2C connectors.
>>
>> I've looked at the drawing Mike posted and to me it seems like I have
>> wired the sockets correctly. I could be wrong though, since my box is
>> a bit different (simpler).
>
> Looking at socket 1, it seems that if you plug anything into the top
> socket (recording device) it will only connect to the Synth in. The "To
> Mixer" path becomes disconnected from everything. Is that what you wanted?
>
> d

Sorry, should have read the original post. It does exactly what you
want. The symptoms you describe are either poor soldering or bad connectors.

d

Re: Soldering switched TS jacks


"Bjarne" <no@no.no> wrote in message
news:cv2m245na3qma87v4imbu7suh6ruqi9ftn@4ax . com ...
> I've taken some pictures
>
> * bgst.dk/socket1.jpg
> * bgst.dk/socket2.jpg
> * bgst.dk/socket3.jpg
>
> The lower socket (synth) is NYS229
> * w w w .neutrik . com /us/en/audio/210_1019408743/NYS229_detail.aspx
>
> The top socket (switched) is NMJ4HC-S
> * w w w .neutrik . com /us/en/industry/210_21541/NMJ4HC-S_detail.aspx
>
> I've tried various cables for the connection to the sockets. Among
> them standard neutrik NP2C connectors.
>
> I've looked at the drawing Mike posted and to me it seems like I have
> wired the sockets correctly. I could be wrong though, since my box is
> a bit different (simpler).




Your second picture seems to show you are using balanced cable to your mixer
but are not using the shield. It looks to me like you have one core to the
socket grounds and the other core to the socket tips. If this is the case
then you need to connect the cable shield to the socket grounds and one or
other of the cores to the tips


Gareth.

Re: Soldering switched TS jacks

>If this is the case
>then you need to connect the cable shield to the socket grounds and one or
>other of the cores to the tips

No it is not the case. The cable shield are connected to ground
together with one of the wires.

Re: Soldering switched TS jacks

Bjarne wrote:

> The top socket (switched) is NMJ4HC-S
> * w w w .neutrik . com /us/en/industry/210 21541/NMJ4HC-S detail.aspx

I've looked at the Neutrik web site and couldn't find a drawing that
identifies the pins on the jack, so I can't confirm that you have it
wired correctly. Are you sure that the two pins that you've connected to
the "synth" jack are the switch contacts and not the tip and sleeve? You
could check it with an ohm meter.

By the way, it's conventional for patchbay jacks to be arranged so that
the top jack is the source (in this case the synth) and the bottom jack
is the destination (the recorder). That way, when nothing is plugged
into either jack, the synth is connected to the destination. If you put
a plug in the synth jack, it's still connected to the recorder, but you
can patch it to another recorder channel, or to a monitor amplifier. or
whatever. But when you put a plug in the recorder jack, it disconnects
from the synth jack above it, so you can patch in a different synth.
That's how half-normalling works.


--
If you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring and reach
me here:
double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo -- I'm really Mike Rivers
(mriv...@d-and-d . com )

Re: Soldering switched TS jacks

"Mike Rivers" wrote ...
> Bjarne wrote:
>> The top socket (switched) is NMJ4HC-S
>> * w w w .neutrik . com /us/en/industry/210_21541/NMJ4HC-S_detail.aspx
>
> I've looked at the Neutrik web site and couldn't find a drawing that
> identifies the pins on the jack, so I can't confirm that you have it wired
> correctly. Are you sure that the two pins that you've connected to the
> "synth" jack are the switch contacts and not the tip and sleeve? You could
> check it with an ohm meter.

This photo he posted: * bgst.dk/socket3.jpg
shows that he has it wired correctly.

> By the way, it's conventional for patchbay jacks to be arranged so that
> the top jack is the source (in this case the synth) and the bottom jack is
> the destination (the recorder). That way, when nothing is plugged into
> either jack, the synth is connected to the destination. If you put a plug
> in the synth jack, it's still connected to the recorder, but you can patch
> it to another recorder channel, or to a monitor amplifier. or whatever.
> But when you put a plug in the recorder jack, it disconnects from the
> synth jack above it, so you can patch in a different synth. That's how
> half-normalling works.

That was confusing. At first I was going to tell him that he
had it wired backwards, but then I realized that he has
the jacks backwards, so it cancells out. :-)

Re: Soldering switched TS jacks

Richard Crowley wrote:

> This photo he posted: * bgst.dk/socket3.jpg
> shows that he has it wired correctly.

How can you tell from that photo which terminals are the switch and
which are direct to tip and sleeve? I can't, but then I don't normally
use that type of jack, and I don't have one around to check.



--
If you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring and reach
me here:
double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo -- I'm really Mike Rivers
(mriv...@d-and-d . com )

Re: Soldering switched TS jacks

"Mike Rivers" wrote ...
> Richard Crowley wrote:
>
>> This photo he posted: * bgst.dk/socket3.jpg
>> shows that he has it wired correctly.
>
> How can you tell from that photo which terminals are the switch and which
> are direct to tip and sleeve? I can't, but then I don't normally use that
> type of jack, and I don't have one around to check.

If you look at the first photo of the series * bgst.dk/socket3.jpg
you will see that the moving contact (the same one that touches
the plug) is on the left as viewed from the back of the connector.
You can see where it goes up and then bends across the center
of the connector. It helps if you have seen some of these kind of
connectors in person.

Re: Soldering switched TS jacks

>That was confusing. At first I was going to tell him that he
>had it wired backwards, but then I realized that he has
>the jacks backwards, so it cancells out. :-)

Well actually I didn't try to make a standard patchbay. The box has
only one purpose: to make it easier for me record my synths. If I
had put the switched jack in the bottom it would be a bit harder for
me to plug in the recording cable, that's why I put it in the top.

Re: Soldering switched TS jacks

>I've looked at the Neutrik web site and couldn't find a drawing that
>identifies the pins on the jack, so I can't confirm that you have it
>wired correctly. Are you sure that the two pins that you've connected to
>the "synth" jack are the switch contacts and not the tip and sleeve? You
>could check it with an ohm meter.
>
>By the way, it's conventional for patchbay jacks to be arranged so that
>the top jack is the source (in this case the synth) and the bottom jack
>is the destination (the recorder). That way, when nothing is plugged
>into either jack, the synth is connected to the destination. If you put
>a plug in the synth jack, it's still connected to the recorder, but you
>can patch it to another recorder channel, or to a monitor amplifier. or
>whatever. But when you put a plug in the recorder jack, it disconnects
>from the synth jack above it, so you can patch in a different synth.
>That's how half-normalling works.

Thanks, but I think I've found the problem. I was the switches that
didn't work correctly. After bending them a bit it seems to work a
lot better. I think I will try some different switches.

Re: Soldering switched TS jacks

"Bjarne" <no@no.no> wrote in message
news:sd0n24l83assap3g6c1noiq9he14fr3mf8@4ax . com ...
> Thanks, but I think I've found the problem. I was the switches that
> didn't work correctly. After bending them a bit it seems to work a
> lot better. I think I will try some different switches.

Looking at
* w w w .neutrik . com /client/neutrik/media/products/view/210_21541.jpg

Your switched jack is is the same design as their PCB mounted jack, and it
looks like it may not make a good contact if the pins aren't secured. If
there's any play in the pins I'd wouldn't have a lot of confidence in the
jack.

I've seen better switched jacks, for sure.

Sean