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Another riding area bites the dust
Re: Another riding area bites the dust
scrape asks:
> I seem to recall an article a few years back about guided tours
> across the Outback. Are these a thing of the past?
I recommend:
http :// www .motorcycleadventuresaustralia,com .au/
I rode with him (Eric - Red) in 2001. Excellent time. Easy
trails for the most part. As you can see from the pics, swimming
was excellent. Eric knows every water hole in the Kimberley.
Can't find my trip report. Pic of McGarry smoking with little
aboriginal kid while there with me started RadRick off on a rant
ya'll might remember. Can't find that either......
Go fast. Take chances.
Mike S.
scrape asks:
> I seem to recall an article a few years back about guided tours
> across the Outback. Are these a thing of the past?
I recommend:
http :// www .motorcycleadventuresaustralia,com .au/
I rode with him (Eric - Red) in 2001. Excellent time. Easy
trails for the most part. As you can see from the pics, swimming
was excellent. Eric knows every water hole in the Kimberley.
Can't find my trip report. Pic of McGarry smoking with little
aboriginal kid while there with me started RadRick off on a rant
ya'll might remember. Can't find that either......
Go fast. Take chances.
Mike S.
Re: Another riding area bites the dust
was it the all encompassing redefined regs on the di-hydrogen-oxide... that
stole our dusty trails?
remember a ot rant of mine about the removal of "navigatible" waters in the
description of what jurisdiction the EPA & core of engineers now over sea...
well the buggers decided to put navigable back in but further muddied the
waters by defining water shed as basically any land up hill of any body of
water that might contribute to a navigable water.... hello that would be
like the whole gosh darn continent that's above sea level... the buggers
just wrote the mother of all regs to steal property rights... they now have
legal status to come onto any property public or private and determine if
your activities on the property are good/bad/ugly
john
pissed and writing more letters/phone calling too.
"Mike Baxter" <mgb***@comcast,net > wrote in message
news:ti1i14l2cl07qgg4chu1aq1k14a52g0vuq@4ax,com ...
> Well, if you haven't ridden at Clear Creek Management Area, well then
> your going to have to wait. It's closed. Ed Tobin from the Salinas
> Ramblers posted it on the South Bay Riders forum. Here is his post:
>
> "I just got off the phone with Rick Cooper and based on the EPA report
> which is due to be released tomorrow, the BLM decided to place an
> emergency closure on the Clear Creek Management Area effective
> immediately. According to Rick, this closure will be in place until
> the BLM completes the EIS process which could take from 18 to 24
> months. The EIS will determine what level of use, if any, will be
> allowed." Ed Tobin
>
> This is the area that the Salinas Ramblers and the Time Keepers
> motorcycle clubs put on their events. It really, REALLY sucks for the
> Ramblers because they own land that borders Clear Creek.
>
> This just means that Hollister Hills will become a more of a zoo than
> it already is. (Four letter words!)
>
> On top of that, they just spent a fortune in green sticker funds
> putting up lot's of new fences, bathrooms, trail markings, trailer
> near entrance for collecting fees.
>
> Thoroughly pissed off
>
> Mike Baxter
was it the all encompassing redefined regs on the di-hydrogen-oxide... that
stole our dusty trails?
remember a ot rant of mine about the removal of "navigatible" waters in the
description of what jurisdiction the EPA & core of engineers now over sea...
well the buggers decided to put navigable back in but further muddied the
waters by defining water shed as basically any land up hill of any body of
water that might contribute to a navigable water.... hello that would be
like the whole gosh darn continent that's above sea level... the buggers
just wrote the mother of all regs to steal property rights... they now have
legal status to come onto any property public or private and determine if
your activities on the property are good/bad/ugly
john
pissed and writing more letters/phone calling too.
"Mike Baxter" <mgb***@comcast,net > wrote in message
news:ti1i14l2cl07qgg4chu1aq1k14a52g0vuq@4ax,com ...
> Well, if you haven't ridden at Clear Creek Management Area, well then
> your going to have to wait. It's closed. Ed Tobin from the Salinas
> Ramblers posted it on the South Bay Riders forum. Here is his post:
>
> "I just got off the phone with Rick Cooper and based on the EPA report
> which is due to be released tomorrow, the BLM decided to place an
> emergency closure on the Clear Creek Management Area effective
> immediately. According to Rick, this closure will be in place until
> the BLM completes the EIS process which could take from 18 to 24
> months. The EIS will determine what level of use, if any, will be
> allowed." Ed Tobin
>
> This is the area that the Salinas Ramblers and the Time Keepers
> motorcycle clubs put on their events. It really, REALLY sucks for the
> Ramblers because they own land that borders Clear Creek.
>
> This just means that Hollister Hills will become a more of a zoo than
> it already is. (Four letter words!)
>
> On top of that, they just spent a fortune in green sticker funds
> putting up lot's of new fences, bathrooms, trail markings, trailer
> near entrance for collecting fees.
>
> Thoroughly pissed off
>
> Mike Baxter
Re: Another riding area bites the dust
On Apr 30, 8:07 pm, Mike Baxter <mgb...@comcast,net > wrote:
> Well, if you haven't ridden at Clear Creek Management Area, well then
> your going to have to wait. It's closed. Ed Tobin from the Salinas
> Ramblers posted it on the South Bay Riders forum. Here is his post:
>
> "I just got off the phone with Rick Cooper and based on the EPA report
> which is due to be released tomorrow, the BLM decided to place an
> emergency closure on the Clear Creek Management Area effective
> immediately. According to Rick, this closure will be in place until
> the BLM completes the EIS process which could take from 18 to 24
> months. The EIS will determine what level of use, if any, will be
> allowed." Ed Tobin
>
> This is the area that the Salinas Ramblers and the Time Keepers
> motorcycle clubs put on their events. It really, REALLY sucks for the
> Ramblers because they own land that borders Clear Creek.
>
> This just means that Hollister Hills will become a more of a zoo than
> it already is. (Four letter words!)
>
> On top of that, they just spent a fortune in green sticker funds
> putting up lot's of new fences, bathrooms, trail markings, trailer
> near entrance for collecting fees.
>
> Thoroughly pissed off
>
> Mike Baxter
They're all going to be closed.
Dark days are coming, in all aspects of American life.
Time to each of us to think about how much trouble we're willing to
get into to go riding.
When the gov't no longer serves the people, any moral and ethical
concerns about breaking those laws go right out the window.
I think the only legitimate reason not to support illegal riding on
public lands is where it will jeapordize remaining access.
In those few areas where there is access.
The only real hope is funding problems for enforcement- but they'll
probably cut funding for that last.
Bleak. Dismal. Hopeless. That is our future.
Dave
On Apr 30, 8:07 pm, Mike Baxter <mgb...@comcast,net > wrote:
> Well, if you haven't ridden at Clear Creek Management Area, well then
> your going to have to wait. It's closed. Ed Tobin from the Salinas
> Ramblers posted it on the South Bay Riders forum. Here is his post:
>
> "I just got off the phone with Rick Cooper and based on the EPA report
> which is due to be released tomorrow, the BLM decided to place an
> emergency closure on the Clear Creek Management Area effective
> immediately. According to Rick, this closure will be in place until
> the BLM completes the EIS process which could take from 18 to 24
> months. The EIS will determine what level of use, if any, will be
> allowed." Ed Tobin
>
> This is the area that the Salinas Ramblers and the Time Keepers
> motorcycle clubs put on their events. It really, REALLY sucks for the
> Ramblers because they own land that borders Clear Creek.
>
> This just means that Hollister Hills will become a more of a zoo than
> it already is. (Four letter words!)
>
> On top of that, they just spent a fortune in green sticker funds
> putting up lot's of new fences, bathrooms, trail markings, trailer
> near entrance for collecting fees.
>
> Thoroughly pissed off
>
> Mike Baxter
They're all going to be closed.
Dark days are coming, in all aspects of American life.
Time to each of us to think about how much trouble we're willing to
get into to go riding.
When the gov't no longer serves the people, any moral and ethical
concerns about breaking those laws go right out the window.
I think the only legitimate reason not to support illegal riding on
public lands is where it will jeapordize remaining access.
In those few areas where there is access.
The only real hope is funding problems for enforcement- but they'll
probably cut funding for that last.
Bleak. Dismal. Hopeless. That is our future.
Dave
Re: Another riding area bites the dust
>> Well, if you haven't ridden at Clear Creek Management Area, well then
>> your going to have to wait. It's closed. Ed Tobin from the Salinas
>> Ramblers posted it on the South Bay Riders forum. Here is his post:
>>
>> "I just got off the phone with Rick Cooper and based on the EPA report
>> which is due to be released tomorrow, the BLM decided to place an
>> emergency closure on the Clear Creek Management Area effective
>> immediately. According to Rick, this closure will be in place until
>> the BLM completes the EIS process which could take from 18 to 24
>> months. The EIS will determine what level of use, if any, will be
>> allowed." Ed Tobin
>>
>> This is the area that the Salinas Ramblers and the Time Keepers
>> motorcycle clubs put on their events. It really, REALLY sucks for the
>> Ramblers because they own land that borders Clear Creek.
>>
>> This just means that Hollister Hills will become a more of a zoo than
>> it already is. (Four letter words!)
>>
>> On top of that, they just spent a fortune in green sticker funds
>> putting up lot's of new fences, bathrooms, trail markings, trailer
>> near entrance for collecting fees.
>>
>> Thoroughly pissed off
>>
>> Mike Baxter
>
>
> They're all going to be closed.
> Dark days are coming, in all aspects of American life.
>
> Time to each of us to think about how much trouble we're willing to
> get into to go riding.
>
> When the gov't no longer serves the people, any moral and ethical
> concerns about breaking those laws go right out the window.
>
> I think the only legitimate reason not to support illegal riding on
> public lands is where it will jeapordize remaining access.
> In those few areas where there is access.
>
> The only real hope is funding problems for enforcement- but they'll
> probably cut funding for that last.
>
>
> Bleak. Dismal. Hopeless. That is our future.
I have a half written letter somehwere in this compooter intended to
enlighten certain politicians. Seeing the folly in such an endevour, I
stopped composing and got on to more solveagble problems that haunt my desk.
But at some point my intent was to point out that closing public lands,
denying acces to public lands, really amounts to the government taking more
and more "undisclosed locations" for their own undisclosed purposes.
The average voter doesn't give a crap about whether we can ride our
dirtbikes. But nobody likes government greed. I wonder if we're painting the
picture with the wrong brush some times.
>> Well, if you haven't ridden at Clear Creek Management Area, well then
>> your going to have to wait. It's closed. Ed Tobin from the Salinas
>> Ramblers posted it on the South Bay Riders forum. Here is his post:
>>
>> "I just got off the phone with Rick Cooper and based on the EPA report
>> which is due to be released tomorrow, the BLM decided to place an
>> emergency closure on the Clear Creek Management Area effective
>> immediately. According to Rick, this closure will be in place until
>> the BLM completes the EIS process which could take from 18 to 24
>> months. The EIS will determine what level of use, if any, will be
>> allowed." Ed Tobin
>>
>> This is the area that the Salinas Ramblers and the Time Keepers
>> motorcycle clubs put on their events. It really, REALLY sucks for the
>> Ramblers because they own land that borders Clear Creek.
>>
>> This just means that Hollister Hills will become a more of a zoo than
>> it already is. (Four letter words!)
>>
>> On top of that, they just spent a fortune in green sticker funds
>> putting up lot's of new fences, bathrooms, trail markings, trailer
>> near entrance for collecting fees.
>>
>> Thoroughly pissed off
>>
>> Mike Baxter
>
>
> They're all going to be closed.
> Dark days are coming, in all aspects of American life.
>
> Time to each of us to think about how much trouble we're willing to
> get into to go riding.
>
> When the gov't no longer serves the people, any moral and ethical
> concerns about breaking those laws go right out the window.
>
> I think the only legitimate reason not to support illegal riding on
> public lands is where it will jeapordize remaining access.
> In those few areas where there is access.
>
> The only real hope is funding problems for enforcement- but they'll
> probably cut funding for that last.
>
>
> Bleak. Dismal. Hopeless. That is our future.
I have a half written letter somehwere in this compooter intended to
enlighten certain politicians. Seeing the folly in such an endevour, I
stopped composing and got on to more solveagble problems that haunt my desk.
But at some point my intent was to point out that closing public lands,
denying acces to public lands, really amounts to the government taking more
and more "undisclosed locations" for their own undisclosed purposes.
The average voter doesn't give a crap about whether we can ride our
dirtbikes. But nobody likes government greed. I wonder if we're painting the
picture with the wrong brush some times.
Re: Another riding area bites the dust
On May 1, 9:03 am, "Dean H." <m...@groove.calm> wrote:
> >> Well, if you haven't ridden at Clear Creek Management Area, well then
> >> your going to have to wait. It's closed. Ed Tobin from the Salinas
> >> Ramblers posted it on the South Bay Riders forum. Here is his post:
>
> >> "I just got off the phone with Rick Cooper and based on the EPA report
> >> which is due to be released tomorrow, the BLM decided to place an
> >> emergency closure on the Clear Creek Management Area effective
> >> immediately. According to Rick, this closure will be in place until
> >> the BLM completes the EIS process which could take from 18 to 24
> >> months. The EIS will determine what level of use, if any, will be
> >> allowed." Ed Tobin
>
> >> This is the area that the Salinas Ramblers and the Time Keepers
> >> motorcycle clubs put on their events. It really, REALLY sucks for the
> >> Ramblers because they own land that borders Clear Creek.
>
> >> This just means that Hollister Hills will become a more of a zoo than
> >> it already is. (Four letter words!)
>
> >> On top of that, they just spent a fortune in green sticker funds
> >> putting up lot's of new fences, bathrooms, trail markings, trailer
> >> near entrance for collecting fees.
>
> >> Thoroughly pissed off
>
> >> Mike Baxter
>
> > They're all going to be closed.
> > Dark days are coming, in all aspects of American life.
>
> > Time to each of us to think about how much trouble we're willing to
> > get into to go riding.
>
> > When the gov't no longer serves the people, any moral and ethical
> > concerns about breaking those laws go right out the window.
>
> > I think the only legitimate reason not to support illegal riding on
> > public lands is where it will jeapordize remaining access.
> > In those few areas where there is access.
>
> > The only real hope is funding problems for enforcement- but they'll
> > probably cut funding for that last.
>
> > Bleak. Dismal. Hopeless. That is our future.
>
> I have a half written letter somehwere in this compooter intended to
> enlighten certain politicians. Seeing the folly in such an endevour, I
> stopped composing and got on to more solveagble problems that haunt my desk.
> But at some point my intent was to point out that closing public lands,
> denying acces to public lands, really amounts to the government taking more
> and more "undisclosed locations" for their own undisclosed purposes.
>
> The average voter doesn't give a crap about whether we can ride our
> dirtbikes. But nobody likes government greed. I wonder if we're painting the
> picture with the wrong brush some times.
I don't think its "the gov't" as root cause, but the fact we have a
system whereby idiots (who should be hung) who think "hey, *they*
shouldn't be doing that, we must stop them" can gain influence in
gov't and pass laws to control the behaviour of 'others' that they
don't like.
The gov'ts failure is in listening to these dolts (because of their
money and influence), and the peoples failure in allowing it to
happen.
eco-eco-tage, sabotage directed against eco-nazies
Dave
On May 1, 9:03 am, "Dean H." <m...@groove.calm> wrote:
> >> Well, if you haven't ridden at Clear Creek Management Area, well then
> >> your going to have to wait. It's closed. Ed Tobin from the Salinas
> >> Ramblers posted it on the South Bay Riders forum. Here is his post:
>
> >> "I just got off the phone with Rick Cooper and based on the EPA report
> >> which is due to be released tomorrow, the BLM decided to place an
> >> emergency closure on the Clear Creek Management Area effective
> >> immediately. According to Rick, this closure will be in place until
> >> the BLM completes the EIS process which could take from 18 to 24
> >> months. The EIS will determine what level of use, if any, will be
> >> allowed." Ed Tobin
>
> >> This is the area that the Salinas Ramblers and the Time Keepers
> >> motorcycle clubs put on their events. It really, REALLY sucks for the
> >> Ramblers because they own land that borders Clear Creek.
>
> >> This just means that Hollister Hills will become a more of a zoo than
> >> it already is. (Four letter words!)
>
> >> On top of that, they just spent a fortune in green sticker funds
> >> putting up lot's of new fences, bathrooms, trail markings, trailer
> >> near entrance for collecting fees.
>
> >> Thoroughly pissed off
>
> >> Mike Baxter
>
> > They're all going to be closed.
> > Dark days are coming, in all aspects of American life.
>
> > Time to each of us to think about how much trouble we're willing to
> > get into to go riding.
>
> > When the gov't no longer serves the people, any moral and ethical
> > concerns about breaking those laws go right out the window.
>
> > I think the only legitimate reason not to support illegal riding on
> > public lands is where it will jeapordize remaining access.
> > In those few areas where there is access.
>
> > The only real hope is funding problems for enforcement- but they'll
> > probably cut funding for that last.
>
> > Bleak. Dismal. Hopeless. That is our future.
>
> I have a half written letter somehwere in this compooter intended to
> enlighten certain politicians. Seeing the folly in such an endevour, I
> stopped composing and got on to more solveagble problems that haunt my desk.
> But at some point my intent was to point out that closing public lands,
> denying acces to public lands, really amounts to the government taking more
> and more "undisclosed locations" for their own undisclosed purposes.
>
> The average voter doesn't give a crap about whether we can ride our
> dirtbikes. But nobody likes government greed. I wonder if we're painting the
> picture with the wrong brush some times.
I don't think its "the gov't" as root cause, but the fact we have a
system whereby idiots (who should be hung) who think "hey, *they*
shouldn't be doing that, we must stop them" can gain influence in
gov't and pass laws to control the behaviour of 'others' that they
don't like.
The gov'ts failure is in listening to these dolts (because of their
money and influence), and the peoples failure in allowing it to
happen.
eco-eco-tage, sabotage directed against eco-nazies
Dave
Re: Another riding area bites the dust
Dean H. wrote:
> The average voter doesn't give a crap about whether we can ride our
> dirtbikes.
Exactly. Besides, we make noise. We're boistrous. We're Hell's Angels
and rape their dogs. Scum of the earth. Killin's too good for us.
> But nobody likes government greed.
Except people who benefit from it because the government takes money
from somebody else and gives it to them.
Remember, citizens, the government knows best what's good for us.
--
Cheers, Bev
===================================="Incontinence hotline, can you hold?"
Dean H. wrote:
> The average voter doesn't give a crap about whether we can ride our
> dirtbikes.
Exactly. Besides, we make noise. We're boistrous. We're Hell's Angels
and rape their dogs. Scum of the earth. Killin's too good for us.
> But nobody likes government greed.
Except people who benefit from it because the government takes money
from somebody else and gives it to them.
Remember, citizens, the government knows best what's good for us.
--
Cheers, Bev
===================================="Incontinence hotline, can you hold?"
Re: Another riding area bites the dust
On May 1, 8:53 am, XR650L Dave <spamTHIS...@yahoo,com > wrote:
> On Apr 30, 8:07 pm, Mike Baxter <mgb...@comcast,net > wrote:
>
>
>
> > Well, if you haven't ridden at Clear Creek Management Area, well then
> > your going to have to wait. It's closed. Ed Tobin from the Salinas
> > Ramblers posted it on the South Bay Riders forum. Here is his post:
>
> > "I just got off the phone with Rick Cooper and based on the EPA report
> > which is due to be released tomorrow, the BLM decided to place an
> > emergency closure on the Clear Creek Management Area effective
> > immediately. According to Rick, this closure will be in place until
> > the BLM completes the EIS process which could take from 18 to 24
> > months. The EIS will determine what level of use, if any, will be
> > allowed." Ed Tobin
>
> > This is the area that the Salinas Ramblers and the Time Keepers
> > motorcycle clubs put on their events. It really, REALLY sucks for the
> > Ramblers because they own land that borders Clear Creek.
>
> > This just means that Hollister Hills will become a more of a zoo than
> > it already is. (Four letter words!)
>
> > On top of that, they just spent a fortune in green sticker funds
> > putting up lot's of new fences, bathrooms, trail markings, trailer
> > near entrance for collecting fees.
>
> > Thoroughly pissed off
>
> > Mike Baxter
>
> They're all going to be closed.
> Dark days are coming, in all aspects of American life.
>
> Time to each of us to think about how much trouble we're willing to
> get into to go riding.
>
> When the gov't no longer serves the people, any moral and ethical
> concerns about breaking those laws go right out the window.
>
> I think the only legitimate reason not to support illegal riding on
> public lands is where it will jeapordize remaining access.
> In those few areas where there is access.
>
> The only real hope is funding problems for enforcement- but they'll
> probably cut funding for that last.
>
> Bleak. Dismal. Hopeless. That is our future.
>
> Dave
Damn, I gotta stop posting before the coffee kicks in.
Dave
On May 1, 8:53 am, XR650L Dave <spamTHIS...@yahoo,com > wrote:
> On Apr 30, 8:07 pm, Mike Baxter <mgb...@comcast,net > wrote:
>
>
>
> > Well, if you haven't ridden at Clear Creek Management Area, well then
> > your going to have to wait. It's closed. Ed Tobin from the Salinas
> > Ramblers posted it on the South Bay Riders forum. Here is his post:
>
> > "I just got off the phone with Rick Cooper and based on the EPA report
> > which is due to be released tomorrow, the BLM decided to place an
> > emergency closure on the Clear Creek Management Area effective
> > immediately. According to Rick, this closure will be in place until
> > the BLM completes the EIS process which could take from 18 to 24
> > months. The EIS will determine what level of use, if any, will be
> > allowed." Ed Tobin
>
> > This is the area that the Salinas Ramblers and the Time Keepers
> > motorcycle clubs put on their events. It really, REALLY sucks for the
> > Ramblers because they own land that borders Clear Creek.
>
> > This just means that Hollister Hills will become a more of a zoo than
> > it already is. (Four letter words!)
>
> > On top of that, they just spent a fortune in green sticker funds
> > putting up lot's of new fences, bathrooms, trail markings, trailer
> > near entrance for collecting fees.
>
> > Thoroughly pissed off
>
> > Mike Baxter
>
> They're all going to be closed.
> Dark days are coming, in all aspects of American life.
>
> Time to each of us to think about how much trouble we're willing to
> get into to go riding.
>
> When the gov't no longer serves the people, any moral and ethical
> concerns about breaking those laws go right out the window.
>
> I think the only legitimate reason not to support illegal riding on
> public lands is where it will jeapordize remaining access.
> In those few areas where there is access.
>
> The only real hope is funding problems for enforcement- but they'll
> probably cut funding for that last.
>
> Bleak. Dismal. Hopeless. That is our future.
>
> Dave
Damn, I gotta stop posting before the coffee kicks in.
Dave
Re: Another riding area bites the dust
Mike this can't be so cause less sound = more ground and Cali has been
under the umbrella of 96db for a years now with riders spending all that
money on compliant exhaust systems.
In reality I'm sorry to hear about this and it sucks large. Is the BRC
aware and able to do anything to help?
Rex McKinney
"Mike Baxter" <mgb***@comcast,net > wrote in message
news:ti1i14l2cl07qgg4chu1aq1k14a52g0vuq@4ax,com ...
> Well, if you haven't ridden at Clear Creek Management Area, well then
> your going to have to wait. It's closed. Ed Tobin from the Salinas
> Ramblers posted it on the South Bay Riders forum. Here is his post:
>
> "I just got off the phone with Rick Cooper and based on the EPA report
> which is due to be released tomorrow, the BLM decided to place an
> emergency closure on the Clear Creek Management Area effective
> immediately. According to Rick, this closure will be in place until
> the BLM completes the EIS process which could take from 18 to 24
> months. The EIS will determine what level of use, if any, will be
> allowed." Ed Tobin
>
> This is the area that the Salinas Ramblers and the Time Keepers
> motorcycle clubs put on their events. It really, REALLY sucks for the
> Ramblers because they own land that borders Clear Creek.
>
> This just means that Hollister Hills will become a more of a zoo than
> it already is. (Four letter words!)
>
> On top of that, they just spent a fortune in green sticker funds
> putting up lot's of new fences, bathrooms, trail markings, trailer
> near entrance for collecting fees.
>
> Thoroughly pissed off
>
> Mike Baxter
Mike this can't be so cause less sound = more ground and Cali has been
under the umbrella of 96db for a years now with riders spending all that
money on compliant exhaust systems.
In reality I'm sorry to hear about this and it sucks large. Is the BRC
aware and able to do anything to help?
Rex McKinney
"Mike Baxter" <mgb***@comcast,net > wrote in message
news:ti1i14l2cl07qgg4chu1aq1k14a52g0vuq@4ax,com ...
> Well, if you haven't ridden at Clear Creek Management Area, well then
> your going to have to wait. It's closed. Ed Tobin from the Salinas
> Ramblers posted it on the South Bay Riders forum. Here is his post:
>
> "I just got off the phone with Rick Cooper and based on the EPA report
> which is due to be released tomorrow, the BLM decided to place an
> emergency closure on the Clear Creek Management Area effective
> immediately. According to Rick, this closure will be in place until
> the BLM completes the EIS process which could take from 18 to 24
> months. The EIS will determine what level of use, if any, will be
> allowed." Ed Tobin
>
> This is the area that the Salinas Ramblers and the Time Keepers
> motorcycle clubs put on their events. It really, REALLY sucks for the
> Ramblers because they own land that borders Clear Creek.
>
> This just means that Hollister Hills will become a more of a zoo than
> it already is. (Four letter words!)
>
> On top of that, they just spent a fortune in green sticker funds
> putting up lot's of new fences, bathrooms, trail markings, trailer
> near entrance for collecting fees.
>
> Thoroughly pissed off
>
> Mike Baxter
Re: Another riding area bites the dust
Here is the reason. I call BS.
The U.S. Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) began conducting a
study in 2004 on asbestos exposures experienced by CCMA users during
typical recreational activities. The study was conducted to provide
BLM with information to manage and minimize human health risks at the
CCMA and to update a similar study conducted by the BLM in 1992.
On May 1, 2008 the EPA released the report, ³CCMA Asbestos Exposure
andHuman Health Risk Assessment.² The report stated the exposures
measured by EPA for many recreational activities at CCMA are ³above
the EPA acceptable risk range of lifetime cancers.² It also notes that
children ³have greater risk than adults due to higher exposure
measurements [and] are of special concern because their exposures
occur earlier in their lives.
Based on the findings in the report, BLM simultaneously enacted an
immediate temporary closure on May 1, 2008 of 31,000 acres of the area
to all public access/entry upon release of the EPA report while a
Resource Management Plan (RMP) to determine the long-term management
of the area is underway. The BLM¹s number one priority is to protect
the public¹s health and safety.
Over the next two years, BLM will be preparing a Resource Management
Plan and Environmental Impact Statement to guide the long-term
management of public lands within the CCMA. EPA and BLM will host a
public meeting to discuss the results of the EPA Human Health Risk
Assessment and BLM will discuss the need for the temporary emergency
closure on May 8, 2008.
The Fee Program has been suspended and partial refunds will be issued
to all persons who purchased a Season Pass.
Public Meetings
May 8, Santa Clara Convention Center, 5001 Great America Parkway,
Santa Clara, EPA and BLM, open house from 3:00 5:00 pm, meeting from
6:00 9:00 pm
May 19, Veteran¹s Memorial Hall, 649 San Benito St., Hollister, 6:00
8:00 pm
May 21, Martin Luther King Jr. Library Room 225, 150 E. San Fernando
St., San Jose, 6:00 8:00 pm
For More Information
Contact the Hollister Field Office at (831) 630-5000 or visit our
website at
http :// www .blm.gov/ca/st/en/fo/holli...ment area.html
On Thu, 1 May 2008 11:23:41 -0600, "endurodog" <endurodog@comcast,net >
wrote:
> Mike this can't be so cause less sound = more ground and Cali has been
>under the umbrella of 96db for a years now with riders spending all that
>money on compliant exhaust systems.
>
> In reality I'm sorry to hear about this and it sucks large. Is the BRC
>aware and able to do anything to help?
>
> Rex McKinney
>
>
>"Mike Baxter" <mgb***@comcast,net > wrote in message
>news:ti1i14l2cl07qgg4chu1aq1k14a52g0vuq@4ax,com ...
>> Well, if you haven't ridden at Clear Creek Management Area, well then
>> your going to have to wait. It's closed. Ed Tobin from the Salinas
>> Ramblers posted it on the South Bay Riders forum. Here is his post:
>>
>> "I just got off the phone with Rick Cooper and based on the EPA report
>> which is due to be released tomorrow, the BLM decided to place an
>> emergency closure on the Clear Creek Management Area effective
>> immediately. According to Rick, this closure will be in place until
>> the BLM completes the EIS process which could take from 18 to 24
>> months. The EIS will determine what level of use, if any, will be
>> allowed." Ed Tobin
>>
>> This is the area that the Salinas Ramblers and the Time Keepers
>> motorcycle clubs put on their events. It really, REALLY sucks for the
>> Ramblers because they own land that borders Clear Creek.
>>
>> This just means that Hollister Hills will become a more of a zoo than
>> it already is. (Four letter words!)
>>
>> On top of that, they just spent a fortune in green sticker funds
>> putting up lot's of new fences, bathrooms, trail markings, trailer
>> near entrance for collecting fees.
>>
>> Thoroughly pissed off
>>
>> Mike Baxter
Here is the reason. I call BS.
The U.S. Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) began conducting a
study in 2004 on asbestos exposures experienced by CCMA users during
typical recreational activities. The study was conducted to provide
BLM with information to manage and minimize human health risks at the
CCMA and to update a similar study conducted by the BLM in 1992.
On May 1, 2008 the EPA released the report, ³CCMA Asbestos Exposure
andHuman Health Risk Assessment.² The report stated the exposures
measured by EPA for many recreational activities at CCMA are ³above
the EPA acceptable risk range of lifetime cancers.² It also notes that
children ³have greater risk than adults due to higher exposure
measurements [and] are of special concern because their exposures
occur earlier in their lives.
Based on the findings in the report, BLM simultaneously enacted an
immediate temporary closure on May 1, 2008 of 31,000 acres of the area
to all public access/entry upon release of the EPA report while a
Resource Management Plan (RMP) to determine the long-term management
of the area is underway. The BLM¹s number one priority is to protect
the public¹s health and safety.
Over the next two years, BLM will be preparing a Resource Management
Plan and Environmental Impact Statement to guide the long-term
management of public lands within the CCMA. EPA and BLM will host a
public meeting to discuss the results of the EPA Human Health Risk
Assessment and BLM will discuss the need for the temporary emergency
closure on May 8, 2008.
The Fee Program has been suspended and partial refunds will be issued
to all persons who purchased a Season Pass.
Public Meetings
May 8, Santa Clara Convention Center, 5001 Great America Parkway,
Santa Clara, EPA and BLM, open house from 3:00 5:00 pm, meeting from
6:00 9:00 pm
May 19, Veteran¹s Memorial Hall, 649 San Benito St., Hollister, 6:00
8:00 pm
May 21, Martin Luther King Jr. Library Room 225, 150 E. San Fernando
St., San Jose, 6:00 8:00 pm
For More Information
Contact the Hollister Field Office at (831) 630-5000 or visit our
website at
http :// www .blm.gov/ca/st/en/fo/holli...ment area.html
On Thu, 1 May 2008 11:23:41 -0600, "endurodog" <endurodog@comcast,net >
wrote:
> Mike this can't be so cause less sound = more ground and Cali has been
>under the umbrella of 96db for a years now with riders spending all that
>money on compliant exhaust systems.
>
> In reality I'm sorry to hear about this and it sucks large. Is the BRC
>aware and able to do anything to help?
>
> Rex McKinney
>
>
>"Mike Baxter" <mgb***@comcast,net > wrote in message
>news:ti1i14l2cl07qgg4chu1aq1k14a52g0vuq@4ax,com ...
>> Well, if you haven't ridden at Clear Creek Management Area, well then
>> your going to have to wait. It's closed. Ed Tobin from the Salinas
>> Ramblers posted it on the South Bay Riders forum. Here is his post:
>>
>> "I just got off the phone with Rick Cooper and based on the EPA report
>> which is due to be released tomorrow, the BLM decided to place an
>> emergency closure on the Clear Creek Management Area effective
>> immediately. According to Rick, this closure will be in place until
>> the BLM completes the EIS process which could take from 18 to 24
>> months. The EIS will determine what level of use, if any, will be
>> allowed." Ed Tobin
>>
>> This is the area that the Salinas Ramblers and the Time Keepers
>> motorcycle clubs put on their events. It really, REALLY sucks for the
>> Ramblers because they own land that borders Clear Creek.
>>
>> This just means that Hollister Hills will become a more of a zoo than
>> it already is. (Four letter words!)
>>
>> On top of that, they just spent a fortune in green sticker funds
>> putting up lot's of new fences, bathrooms, trail markings, trailer
>> near entrance for collecting fees.
>>
>> Thoroughly pissed off
>>
>> Mike Baxter
Re: Another riding area bites the dust
On May 1, 1:23 pm, "endurodog" <enduro...@comcast,net > wrote:
> Mike this can't be so cause less sound = more ground and Cali has been
> under the umbrella of 96db for a years now with riders spending all that
> money on compliant exhaust systems.
From what I'm reading, it's the EPA saying there is asbestos in the
area and "it's not safe" to be there. A completely new tactic.
On May 1, 1:23 pm, "endurodog" <enduro...@comcast,net > wrote:
> Mike this can't be so cause less sound = more ground and Cali has been
> under the umbrella of 96db for a years now with riders spending all that
> money on compliant exhaust systems.
From what I'm reading, it's the EPA saying there is asbestos in the
area and "it's not safe" to be there. A completely new tactic.
Re: Another riding area bites the dust
>> Mike this can't be so cause less sound = more ground and Cali has been
>> under the umbrella of 96db for a years now with riders spending all that
>> money on compliant exhaust systems.
>
> From what I'm reading, it's the EPA saying there is asbestos in the
> area and "it's not safe" to be there. A completely new tactic.
UGH!
Looking around the web:
"Where does asbestos come from?Asbestos minerals come from metamorphic
rocks. Significant deposits of asbestos are located in the western United
States. However, the mountains of North and South Carolina also have
extensive deposits of asbestos minerals. Some small deposits are found in
the Smoky Mountains of East Tennessee. There is currently no production of
asbestos in the United States. Most of the asbestos used here is imported
from Canada."
and some pictures of mines:
http :// www .health.state.mn.us/divs/eh/asbestos/#where1
getting specific about California:
from:
http :// pubs.usgs.gov/of/1995/ofr-95-0831/CHAP5.pdf
"Potential environmental considerations
(1) Most natural exposures of asbestos-bearing rock, particularly
serpentinite derived from ultramafic rocks, are
readily eroded by natural agents and the activities of man because most
serpentinite is composed of weak, highly
fractured rock; however, some serpentinite bodies are highly resistant to
erosion.
(2) Sedimentary deposits and debris slides derived from asbestos-bearing
rocks provide asbestos for redistribution
by water and wind.
(3) Vehicles driven across serpentinite and mine waste can dislodge
asbestos, adding it to dust or making it readily
available to surface drainage; roads also produce channels that aid run-off.
The surface area of roads in the southern
half of the chrysotile-bearing New Idria serpentinite in San Benito County,
Calif., exceeds the area disturbed by the
three largest asbestos mines in this area (Woodward-Clyde Associates, 1989).
(4) Waste generated from asbestos mining and milling operations exposes
asbestos to erosion by natural agents. The
U.S. Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) considers mine waste that
contains more than 1 volume percent
asbestos hazardous (Derkies, 1985, p. 4-34). The California Air Resources
Board considers asbestos contents of mine
waste greater than 5 volume percent as a potential toxic hazard (Resolution
91-27, April 1990).
(5) Asbestos fibers can be incorporated by surface drainage in areas of
asbestos-bearing rocks and mines. In central
California, water in the California Aqueduct System contains asbestos
(Kanarek and others, 1980; Coleman, in press).
However, the EPA has concluded that ingestion of asbestos fibers poses no
significant cancer risk (U.S.
Environmental Protection Agency, 1991).
(6) Chrysotile deposits may contain small amounts of fibrous tremolite,
which is classifiable by EPA as asbestos and
a risk to human health (U.S. Occupational Safety and Health Administration,
1975).
7) Health risks to humans from exposure to small quantities of chrysotile
asbestos in the environment are
controversial. The controversy results from the EPA assumption that any
amount of asbestos is potentially hazardous.
Oh, well, here you go:
http :// www .epa.gov/region09/toxic/noa/clearcreek/index.html
Introduction
Larger version | Closer look
The Clear Creek Management Area (CCMA) in San Benito and Fresno Counties is
located on one of the largest naturally occurring asbestos deposits in the
world. The rugged terrain overlaying this 31,000-acre serpentine deposit is
a popular and challenging riding spot for off-road motorcyclists. The
naturally barren slopes, bald ridges, chaparral and rare plants are also
enjoyed by rock collectors, botanists, hikers, hunters and campers,
including families with children. Thousands of visitors each year use
hundreds of miles of criss-crossing routes, a legacy of historic mining
activities in the area.
The CCMA is managed by the Department of the Interior's Bureau of Land
Management (BLM). Within the boundaries of the CCMA is the Atlas Asbestos
Mine Superfund site. In 1991, EPA signed the Record of Decision (ROD)
selecting the cleanup remedy for the Atlas Mine. In the ROD, EPA designated
the CCMA as one of four geographic areas that comprise the site, but did not
propose a cleanup action for the CCMA. Instead, EPA stated that it would
evaluate whether the BLM's plans for management of CCMA were adequate to
protect public health from exposure to asbestos found in the CCMA's soil and
air. BLM has designated the area as hazardous, and asbestos warning signs
are posted at entry points and on bulletin boards.
Map of study area.
Larger version
In 2004, as part of the evaluation of the Atlas Mine cleanup for possible
delisting of the site from the federal Superfund list, EPA initiated an
asbestos exposure and human health risk assessment for the CCMA. The goals
of the assessment were:
a.. To update the 1992 BLM Human Health Risk Assessment by using current
asbestos sampling and analytical techniques, and
b.. To evaluate risks to children because families are frequent visitors
to CCMA.
>> Mike this can't be so cause less sound = more ground and Cali has been
>> under the umbrella of 96db for a years now with riders spending all that
>> money on compliant exhaust systems.
>
> From what I'm reading, it's the EPA saying there is asbestos in the
> area and "it's not safe" to be there. A completely new tactic.
UGH!
Looking around the web:
"Where does asbestos come from?Asbestos minerals come from metamorphic
rocks. Significant deposits of asbestos are located in the western United
States. However, the mountains of North and South Carolina also have
extensive deposits of asbestos minerals. Some small deposits are found in
the Smoky Mountains of East Tennessee. There is currently no production of
asbestos in the United States. Most of the asbestos used here is imported
from Canada."
and some pictures of mines:
http :// www .health.state.mn.us/divs/eh/asbestos/#where1
getting specific about California:
from:
http :// pubs.usgs.gov/of/1995/ofr-95-0831/CHAP5.pdf
"Potential environmental considerations
(1) Most natural exposures of asbestos-bearing rock, particularly
serpentinite derived from ultramafic rocks, are
readily eroded by natural agents and the activities of man because most
serpentinite is composed of weak, highly
fractured rock; however, some serpentinite bodies are highly resistant to
erosion.
(2) Sedimentary deposits and debris slides derived from asbestos-bearing
rocks provide asbestos for redistribution
by water and wind.
(3) Vehicles driven across serpentinite and mine waste can dislodge
asbestos, adding it to dust or making it readily
available to surface drainage; roads also produce channels that aid run-off.
The surface area of roads in the southern
half of the chrysotile-bearing New Idria serpentinite in San Benito County,
Calif., exceeds the area disturbed by the
three largest asbestos mines in this area (Woodward-Clyde Associates, 1989).
(4) Waste generated from asbestos mining and milling operations exposes
asbestos to erosion by natural agents. The
U.S. Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) considers mine waste that
contains more than 1 volume percent
asbestos hazardous (Derkies, 1985, p. 4-34). The California Air Resources
Board considers asbestos contents of mine
waste greater than 5 volume percent as a potential toxic hazard (Resolution
91-27, April 1990).
(5) Asbestos fibers can be incorporated by surface drainage in areas of
asbestos-bearing rocks and mines. In central
California, water in the California Aqueduct System contains asbestos
(Kanarek and others, 1980; Coleman, in press).
However, the EPA has concluded that ingestion of asbestos fibers poses no
significant cancer risk (U.S.
Environmental Protection Agency, 1991).
(6) Chrysotile deposits may contain small amounts of fibrous tremolite,
which is classifiable by EPA as asbestos and
a risk to human health (U.S. Occupational Safety and Health Administration,
1975).
7) Health risks to humans from exposure to small quantities of chrysotile
asbestos in the environment are
controversial. The controversy results from the EPA assumption that any
amount of asbestos is potentially hazardous.
Oh, well, here you go:
http :// www .epa.gov/region09/toxic/noa/clearcreek/index.html
Introduction
Larger version | Closer look
The Clear Creek Management Area (CCMA) in San Benito and Fresno Counties is
located on one of the largest naturally occurring asbestos deposits in the
world. The rugged terrain overlaying this 31,000-acre serpentine deposit is
a popular and challenging riding spot for off-road motorcyclists. The
naturally barren slopes, bald ridges, chaparral and rare plants are also
enjoyed by rock collectors, botanists, hikers, hunters and campers,
including families with children. Thousands of visitors each year use
hundreds of miles of criss-crossing routes, a legacy of historic mining
activities in the area.
The CCMA is managed by the Department of the Interior's Bureau of Land
Management (BLM). Within the boundaries of the CCMA is the Atlas Asbestos
Mine Superfund site. In 1991, EPA signed the Record of Decision (ROD)
selecting the cleanup remedy for the Atlas Mine. In the ROD, EPA designated
the CCMA as one of four geographic areas that comprise the site, but did not
propose a cleanup action for the CCMA. Instead, EPA stated that it would
evaluate whether the BLM's plans for management of CCMA were adequate to
protect public health from exposure to asbestos found in the CCMA's soil and
air. BLM has designated the area as hazardous, and asbestos warning signs
are posted at entry points and on bulletin boards.
Map of study area.
Larger version
In 2004, as part of the evaluation of the Atlas Mine cleanup for possible
delisting of the site from the federal Superfund list, EPA initiated an
asbestos exposure and human health risk assessment for the CCMA. The goals
of the assessment were:
a.. To update the 1992 BLM Human Health Risk Assessment by using current
asbestos sampling and analytical techniques, and
b.. To evaluate risks to children because families are frequent visitors
to CCMA.
Re: Another riding area bites the dust
>> From what I'm reading, it's the EPA saying there is asbestos in the
>> area and "it's not safe" to be there. A completely new tactic.
I'm just noting the irony in this thread's header.
>> From what I'm reading, it's the EPA saying there is asbestos in the
>> area and "it's not safe" to be there. A completely new tactic.
I'm just noting the irony in this thread's header.
Re: Another riding area bites the dust
On Thu, 1 May 2008 14:42:16 -0400, "Dean H." <moto@groove.calm> wrote:
>>> From what I'm reading, it's the EPA saying there is asbestos in the
>>> area and "it's not safe" to be there. A completely new tactic.
>
>I'm just noting the irony in this thread's header.
>
Yes it is and that is why I chose it.
Mike Baxter
On Thu, 1 May 2008 14:42:16 -0400, "Dean H." <moto@groove.calm> wrote:
>>> From what I'm reading, it's the EPA saying there is asbestos in the
>>> area and "it's not safe" to be there. A completely new tactic.
>
>I'm just noting the irony in this thread's header.
>
Yes it is and that is why I chose it.
Mike Baxter
Re: Another riding area bites the dust
"scrapeNO-Thanks@nc.rr,com " <scrape@mindspring,com > wrote in message
news:08c424d3-75ec-46e4-b199-f3d017d4a5aa@x35g2000hsb.googlegroups,com ...
>
> From what I'm reading, it's the EPA saying there is asbestos in the
> area and "it's not safe" to be there. A completely new tactic.
The asbestos has been out there for years. I rode a national enduro there
in 98 with Mr Baxter and they had warning signs up at that time so this
isn't a new discovery, not sure if it's a new spin.
Rex McKinney
"scrapeNO-Thanks@nc.rr,com " <scrape@mindspring,com > wrote in message
news:08c424d3-75ec-46e4-b199-f3d017d4a5aa@x35g2000hsb.googlegroups,com ...
>
> From what I'm reading, it's the EPA saying there is asbestos in the
> area and "it's not safe" to be there. A completely new tactic.
The asbestos has been out there for years. I rode a national enduro there
in 98 with Mr Baxter and they had warning signs up at that time so this
isn't a new discovery, not sure if it's a new spin.
Rex McKinney
Re: Another riding area bites the dust
On May 1, 3:36 pm, "endurodog" <enduro...@comcast,net > wrote:
> > From what I'm reading, it's the EPA saying there is asbestos in the
> > area and "it's not safe" to be there. A completely new tactic.
>
> The asbestos has been out there for years. I rode a national enduro there
> in 98 with Mr Baxter and they had warning signs up at that time so this
> isn't a new discovery, not sure if it's a new spin.
I think to believe otherwise would be naive. They've got better
lawyers than we do. And more of them.
On May 1, 3:36 pm, "endurodog" <enduro...@comcast,net > wrote:
> > From what I'm reading, it's the EPA saying there is asbestos in the
> > area and "it's not safe" to be there. A completely new tactic.
>
> The asbestos has been out there for years. I rode a national enduro there
> in 98 with Mr Baxter and they had warning signs up at that time so this
> isn't a new discovery, not sure if it's a new spin.
I think to believe otherwise would be naive. They've got better
lawyers than we do. And more of them.
