Somehow this confused the HD dealership...

Re: Somehow this confused the HD dealership...

On Sun, 27 Apr 2008 14:41:39 -0400, Dean <> wrote:

> Old Crow wrote:
>
>Snip
>>
>>Best Harley dealership parts guy I know works at Bowling Green HD.
>>
>>Got me the adjuster for the rear axle on my FLT('82)off the shelf
>>after the local Little Rock dealer had told me they were discontinued.
>>Then he managed to find a rubber pad for my brake pedal...another
>>"discontinued" part.
>>
>>Too bad I don't live closer to Bowling Green.
>
>Damn nice owner also. I spent the night in BG on the way to Biloxi.
>The new dealership is just across the interstate from where we stayed.
>Killing time; my pal and I were browsing the floor and goodies dept.
>when a fellow asked if we were finding what we needed. After telling
>him we were just killing time while traveling; I mentioned that I'd
>never noticed his shop before and he proceeded to introduce himself as
>the owner, told us the store had been there just (I think) three years
>and then took us on a tour of the whole building. He owned a really
>fine looking Heritage Classic which was parked back in storage.
>
>Invited us to stop back anytime for refreshments and a visit.
>
>Dean
>'06 FLHR

Yeah, it was kinda stormy the day we were there, and I was futzing
with my phone trying to pull up a weather map. Parts guy hit a couple
of buttons on his 'puter and turned the monitor around. Full screen
color shot of the local radar.
Took one look at all the yellow and red on the map and said "Too hip,
gotta go" and split. Got wet anyway, but at least I had new rubber on
my brake pedal.
--
Old Crow
'82 FLTC(P)
'95 Wrangler YJ
BS#132, TOMKAT, SENS, SLOB#13
** Posted from http :// www .teranews,com **

Re: Somehow this confused the HD dealership...

"Jinks" <Jinks@thecomputer,com > wrote in message
news:d6i814pnq2959c2nc92s4uhc6v1dk9ogqe@4ax,com ...
> On Sun, 27 Apr 2008 02:42:10 -0400, "Stingy Bastard"
> <321bozocatchy@comcast,net >
> wrote:
>
> <snip a funny yet all too familiar tale>
>>When I got home I warned The Wife that the dealership will be calling, and
>>to just say, "Dunlop." See, they never asked that part.
>>
>>Prost!
>
> The dealership in the town I *Used* to live in can/will only sell you
> the part for the *exact* year & model. Go in & ask for lifters for an
> EVO big
> twin.
> "Which year & model"?
>
> '86 FXR.
>
> Flip, flip, flip,.....ahh, here it is! Part # XXXXX-XX
>
> No, wait! I meant '89 FXWG, sorry.........
>
> Ok, flip, flip, flip,.......ahh, here it is! Part # XXXXX-XX (same #)
>
> Friend steps up & says, "No, no, we're gonna put these in the '93 FXR!
>
> Oh yeah, you're right!
>
> Hump! flip, flip, flip.........Ok, here it is! Part # XXXXX-XX (same #)
> You sure these are the ones you want?
>
> Ahh, any you got will do..........................8^) (BTW, they're all
> in the same bin. Harley don't hire the brightest parts help)
> -
>
> Jinks ('86FXRS, '07 FLTR)
> #64
> Remember, "No good deed goes unpunished"

A few years back I replaced an oil pan gasket on a 300 Ford six cylinder.
Now the vehicle I was working on was a cobbled up Johnny Cash special so I
had no idea what year the engine was, but it did not make a difference,
other than to the computer at the parts store. When the kid at the counter
asked what year I told him I did not know, but it did not mater, just pick
one, he got a little excited. He told me I needed the year or the part may
not fit, so I just spit out 1978. He looked at me funny, like I was gonna
get the wrong part or something and went and got me the gasket. He reminded
me that it may be the wrong one. Then I showed him the package, fits Ford
300-6 from 1962 to 1990, (or what ever the dates were), at any rate, all of
'em.
--
PoorUB
'05 Ultra Classic

Re: Somehow this confused the HD dealership...

In article <tJ3Rj.321711$uN4.218865@fe07.news.easynews,com >,
"Greg O" <goo1959SPAM@hotmail,com > wrote:

> He reminded
> me that it may be the wrong one. Then I showed him the package, fits Ford
> 300-6 from 1962 to 1990, (or what ever the dates were), at any rate, all of
> 'em.

No fun. A friend of mine has a 1976 Country Squire wagon. 460, C6, 9
inch rear (big bearing). Before you hot rod guys drool - that was
factory on that car. I think towing package or some sort.

It's got disc brakes. All four wheels. Yes, this was factory, too.

Try getting some teenager at the auto parts store, who's only seen
Hondas, to believe this. Took my friend 15 minutes, once.

Oh yes, that thing's insane, too. longer, wider than an excursion. And
the 460's a beast - we worked on it one day, went to Autozone for
something, while he's shopping, I'm looking at a cute little V8 motor on
a stand - that typical 'we rebuild these!' display.

Chevy 350.

Yeah, they look tiny after spending a day under the hood of that Ford....

Oh, and drinks for everyone here - I think I figured out how to expense
these things :)

Re: Somehow this confused the HD dealership...

"Philip Nasadowski" <nasadowsk@usermale,com > wrote in message
news:nasadowsk-9E4DF8.14585827042008@news.optonline,net ...
> In article <tJ3Rj.321711$uN4.218865@fe07.news.easynews,com >,
> "Greg O" <goo1959SPAM@hotmail,com > wrote:
>
>> He reminded
>> me that it may be the wrong one. Then I showed him the package, fits Ford
>> 300-6 from 1962 to 1990, (or what ever the dates were), at any rate, all
>> of
>> 'em.
>
> No fun. A friend of mine has a 1976 Country Squire wagon. 460, C6, 9
> inch rear (big bearing). Before you hot rod guys drool - that was
> factory on that car. I think towing package or some sort.
>
> It's got disc brakes. All four wheels. Yes, this was factory, too.
>
>

I worked at a Standard Oil station in high school. One customer had one of
those tanks! He pulled a huge camper trailer with it, 24 foot IIRC.

--
PoorUB
'05 Ultra Classic

Re: Somehow this confused the HD dealership...

In article <Ky5Rj.545723$Gl5.113174@fe02.news.easynews,com >,
"Greg O" <goo1959SPAM@hotmail,com > wrote:

> I worked at a Standard Oil station in high school. One customer had one of
> those tanks! He pulled a huge camper trailer with it, 24 foot IIRC.

I'm sure he was a pretty frequent customer, too. My friend's lucky to
get 7 mpg with that beast - needless to say, it doesn't head out much
these days.

We rebuilt the C6 a few years ago. That thing makes a turbo 400 look
tiny. Apparently, they only use the 4 pinion rear carrier on diesels,
since the threes just don't blow up behind gas motors.

Re: Somehow this confused the HD dealership...

On Sun, 27 Apr 2008 18:37:13 GMT, "Greg O" <goo1959SPAM@hotmail,com > wrote:

<Snip>
> He reminded
>me that it may be the wrong one. Then I showed him the package, fits Ford
>300-6 from 1962 to 1990, (or what ever the dates were), at any rate, all of
>'em.

Well, since we're tellin' stories........ Yeah, it ain't just Harley
parts geeks!
Back in the *early* '70's not long after the Honda 750 took over
motorcycling, a friend & I read about some guy that had mounted a rotor & brake
caliper to the right leg of a 750. He didn't have it plumbed so it didn't work,
but since Honda had been kind enough to put the bosses on the fork leg we
figured we might as well use 'em.
I gathered up a bunch of parts, bolted 'em on, & plumbed it. It worked!
The master cylinder was a bit small, but with two binders it just made it feel
like power brakes. It'd stop the front wheel with two fingers from any speed,
you just used more lever.
Since I was always the guinee pig my friend waited till he saw mine
work, then insisted I help him do one on his. We were at one of the local Honda
shops pickin' up the last of the necessary parts when the parts geek (who knew
both of us & our bikes) told me, "too bad you have the wrong year to do this to
yours". Not quite gettin' what he was talkin' about I ask what he meant. He
told me that my wheel was different, & I couldn't mount a rotor on that side.
Well, I told him that not only could I do it, but I had done it, it worked, &
was sittin' outside the front door. He argued, I told him three times, & he
told me I didn't know what I was talkin' about. Finally I asked how much money
was in the cash register. He thought I was changin' the subject till I told him
to put it on the counter. I'd match it, & if he was right he could keep it
all......but....................if he was wrong! Chickenshit backed down, but
sometimes you gotta hit 'em real hard to get their attention.
'Course the city logo for Jax is "You can't do that!"
-

Jinks ('86FXRS, '07 FLTR)
#64
Remember, "No good deed goes unpunished"

Re: Somehow this confused the HD dealership...

> 'Course the city logo for Jax is "You can't do that!"
> Jinks ('86FXRS, '07 FLTR)

went into Nextel shop last week . I have a Blackberry -in the box- in my
hand.
I axes "do you have a Sim card for a Blackberry ?"
He says no and starts to open the box
I ax again "do you have a Sim card for a Blackberry ?"
He stops and says no again - I take the box out of his hand and says
'Then you don't need to open the box"
*dumb look *

kickstart

Re: Somehow this confused the HD dealership...

On Sun, 27 Apr 2008 16:08:11 -0400, "Kickstart"
<cwalker3@tampabay.rr,com > wrote:

>> 'Course the city logo for Jax is "You can't do that!"
>> Jinks ('86FXRS, '07 FLTR)
>
>went into Nextel shop last week . I have a Blackberry -in the box- in my
>hand.
>I axes "do you have a Sim card for a Blackberry ?"
>He says no and starts to open the box
>I ax again "do you have a Sim card for a Blackberry ?"
>He stops and says no again - I take the box out of his hand and says
>'Then you don't need to open the box"
> *dumb look *

Goes back to childhood when a kid gotta B-day present and th' other
kids had ta have one too or they'd cry. Didja make him cry Danny?

Snarl

Re: Somehow this confused the HD dealership...

On Sun, 27 Apr 2008 15:28:29 -0400, Jinks <Jinks@thecomputer,com >
wrote:

>On Sun, 27 Apr 2008 18:37:13 GMT, "Greg O" <goo1959SPAM@hotmail,com > wrote:
>
><Snip>
>> He reminded
>>me that it may be the wrong one. Then I showed him the package, fits Ford
>>300-6 from 1962 to 1990, (or what ever the dates were), at any rate, all of
>>'em.
>
> Well, since we're tellin' stories........ Yeah, it ain't just Harley
>parts geeks!
> Back in the *early* '70's not long after the Honda 750 took over
>motorcycling, a friend & I read about some guy that had mounted a rotor & brake
>caliper to the right leg of a 750. He didn't have it plumbed so it didn't work,
>but since Honda had been kind enough to put the bosses on the fork leg we
>figured we might as well use 'em.
> I gathered up a bunch of parts, bolted 'em on, & plumbed it. It worked!
>The master cylinder was a bit small, but with two binders it just made it feel
>like power brakes. It'd stop the front wheel with two fingers from any speed,
>you just used more lever.
> Since I was always the guinee pig my friend waited till he saw mine
>work, then insisted I help him do one on his. We were at one of the local Honda
>shops pickin' up the last of the necessary parts when the parts geek (who knew
>both of us & our bikes) told me, "too bad you have the wrong year to do this to
>yours". Not quite gettin' what he was talkin' about I ask what he meant. He
>told me that my wheel was different, & I couldn't mount a rotor on that side.
>Well, I told him that not only could I do it, but I had done it, it worked, &
>was sittin' outside the front door. He argued, I told him three times, & he
>told me I didn't know what I was talkin' about. Finally I asked how much money
>was in the cash register. He thought I was changin' the subject till I told him
>to put it on the counter. I'd match it, & if he was right he could keep it
>all......but....................if he was wrong! Chickenshit backed down, but
>sometimes you gotta hit 'em real hard to get their attention.
> 'Course the city logo for Jax is "You can't do that!"
>-
>
>Jinks ('86FXRS, '07 FLTR)
>#64
>Remember, "No good deed goes unpunished"

Similar to what somebody said when I was running the hydraulic rear
drum brake off an old shovel on my Sporty.
"You can't do that, it'll turn backwards".
Uh, yeah, but both shoes are the same, so that didn't seem to affect
braking performance..,it still stopped a lot faster than the stock
mechanical brake.
--
Old Crow
'82 FLTC(P)
'95 Wrangler YJ
BS#132, TOMKAT, SENS, SLOB#13
** Posted from http :// www .teranews,com **

Re: Somehow this confused the HD dealership...


"Stingy Bastard" <321bozocatchy@comcast,net > wrote in message
news:IqadnahTs6EtvYnVnZ2dnUVZ_uGdnZ2d@comcast,com ...
> All I wanted is to have new tires on my wheels. It's a '75 FLH. I
> brought in the loose wheels. For tires. Is this hard? Have a drink, I
> got pitchers of beer, apple cider and some egg nog, anything else ask
> Shirley and I'd stay away from the egg nog, it smells funny.
>
> "Hi, I called earlier, I need tires."
>
> "Okay, you brought in the bike?"
>
> "No, the wheels."
>
> Silence, then some keypad work. Lots of keypad work.
>
> I interrupt the silence, "I won't be able to pick them up until next
> weekend. Slide the job in when it's slow. And I want the front tire
> back."
>
> "Why?"
>
> Thinking, 'None of your ficking business', I answer, "It's complicated. I
> just want it back."
>
> More keypad work, followed by, "Okay, all set."
>
> I innocently ask, "At what point in the process do I get to tell you what
> kind of tire I want?"
>
> "Uuuum...they usually just put the stock tire on there."
>
> "That's fine. I want the narrow whitewall, please."
>
> More keypad work. "Okay, all set."
>
> I had my son with me. He's 8 and he's a little rock star with the Ladies
> at the counter there. He wanted to see if they had anymore keychains,
> like last time. He and I went into the boutique to look around and angle
> for a keychain, when the kid from the service dept. hunts me down to ask
> me a question about the year of the bike, and then before I leave, the
> service manager...The Service Manager...hunts me down saying, "I don't
> know if we'll have tires that fit a bike that old."
>
> I assure him that it's the same tire that every FLH wears.
>
> The boy walked out of there with *two* keychains, what a little rock star
> he is.
>
> When I got home I warned The Wife that the dealership will be calling, and
> to just say, "Dunlop." See, they never asked that part.
>
> Prost!
>
> --
> Don
> Concede to idiot cagers. Right of Way is irrelevant during the collision.
> No bozo to reply
>
>

but...but...but now they cannot charge you to remove and re-install the
wheels. Ant they cannot inspect it and find other chargeable items.
Thanks for the java.

Re: Somehow this confused the HD dealership...

"another nogn" <tg2122460@yahoo,com > wrote in message
news:k7qdneTwNIlvF4nVnZ2dnUVZ_q-jnZ2d@sentex,net ...
>
> "Stingy Bastard" <321bozocatchy@comcast,net > wrote in message
> news:IqadnahTs6EtvYnVnZ2dnUVZ_uGdnZ2d@comcast,com ...
>> All I wanted is to have new tires on my wheels. It's a '75 FLH. I
>> brought in the loose wheels. For tires. Is this hard? Have a drink, I
>> got pitchers of beer, apple cider and some egg nog, anything else ask
>> Shirley and I'd stay away from the egg nog, it smells funny.
>>
>> "Hi, I called earlier, I need tires."
>>
>> "Okay, you brought in the bike?"
>>
>> "No, the wheels."
>>
>> Silence, then some keypad work. Lots of keypad work.
>>
>> I interrupt the silence, "I won't be able to pick them up until next
>> weekend. Slide the job in when it's slow. And I want the front tire
>> back."
>>
>> "Why?"
>>
>> Thinking, 'None of your ficking business', I answer, "It's complicated.
>> I just want it back."
>>
>> More keypad work, followed by, "Okay, all set."
>>
>> I innocently ask, "At what point in the process do I get to tell you what
>> kind of tire I want?"
>>
>> "Uuuum...they usually just put the stock tire on there."
>>
>> "That's fine. I want the narrow whitewall, please."
>>
>> More keypad work. "Okay, all set."
>>
>> I had my son with me. He's 8 and he's a little rock star with the Ladies
>> at the counter there. He wanted to see if they had anymore keychains,
>> like last time. He and I went into the boutique to look around and angle
>> for a keychain, when the kid from the service dept. hunts me down to ask
>> me a question about the year of the bike, and then before I leave, the
>> service manager...The Service Manager...hunts me down saying, "I don't
>> know if we'll have tires that fit a bike that old."
>>
>> I assure him that it's the same tire that every FLH wears.
>>
>> The boy walked out of there with *two* keychains, what a little rock star
>> he is.
>>
>> When I got home I warned The Wife that the dealership will be calling,
>> and to just say, "Dunlop." See, they never asked that part.
>>
>> Prost!
>>
>> --
>> Don
>> Concede to idiot cagers. Right of Way is irrelevant during the
>> collision.
>> No bozo to reply
>>
>>
>
> but...but...but now they cannot charge you to remove and re-install the
> wheels. Ant they cannot inspect it and find other chargeable items.
> Thanks for the java.
>
>

Actually, that was one of the points of confusion. Since I want the old
tire back they had to figure out what to do about the "tire recycling fee".
Kept'em busy, I did. Pushing the envelope, yep, that's me okay.

--
Don
Concede to idiot cagers. Right of Way is irrelevant during the collision.
No bozo to reply

Re: Somehow this confused the HD dealership...

On Sun, 27 Apr 2008 12:49:21 -0400, "Stingy Bastard"
<321bozocatchy@comcast,net > wrote:

>"another nogn" <tg2122460@yahoo,com > wrote in message
>news:k7qdneTwNIlvF4nVnZ2dnUVZ_q-jnZ2d@sentex,net ...
>>
>> "Stingy Bastard" <321bozocatchy@comcast,net > wrote in message
>> news:IqadnahTs6EtvYnVnZ2dnUVZ_uGdnZ2d@comcast,com ...
>>> All I wanted is to have new tires on my wheels. It's a '75 FLH. I
>>> brought in the loose wheels. For tires. Is this hard? Have a drink, I
>>> got pitchers of beer, apple cider and some egg nog, anything else ask
>>> Shirley and I'd stay away from the egg nog, it smells funny.
>>>
>>> "Hi, I called earlier, I need tires."
>>>
>>> "Okay, you brought in the bike?"
>>>
>>> "No, the wheels."
>>>
>>> Silence, then some keypad work. Lots of keypad work.
>>>
>>> I interrupt the silence, "I won't be able to pick them up until next
>>> weekend. Slide the job in when it's slow. And I want the front tire
>>> back."
>>>
>>> "Why?"
>>>
>>> Thinking, 'None of your ficking business', I answer, "It's complicated.
>>> I just want it back."
>>>
>>> More keypad work, followed by, "Okay, all set."
>>>
>>> I innocently ask, "At what point in the process do I get to tell you what
>>> kind of tire I want?"
>>>
>>> "Uuuum...they usually just put the stock tire on there."
>>>
>>> "That's fine. I want the narrow whitewall, please."
>>>
>>> More keypad work. "Okay, all set."
>>>
>>> I had my son with me. He's 8 and he's a little rock star with the Ladies
>>> at the counter there. He wanted to see if they had anymore keychains,
>>> like last time. He and I went into the boutique to look around and angle
>>> for a keychain, when the kid from the service dept. hunts me down to ask
>>> me a question about the year of the bike, and then before I leave, the
>>> service manager...The Service Manager...hunts me down saying, "I don't
>>> know if we'll have tires that fit a bike that old."
>>>
>>> I assure him that it's the same tire that every FLH wears.
>>>
>>> The boy walked out of there with *two* keychains, what a little rock star
>>> he is.
>>>
>>> When I got home I warned The Wife that the dealership will be calling,
>>> and to just say, "Dunlop." See, they never asked that part.
>>>
>>> Prost!
>>>
>>> --
>>> Don
>>> Concede to idiot cagers. Right of Way is irrelevant during the
>>> collision.
>>> No bozo to reply
>>>
>>>
>>
>> but...but...but now they cannot charge you to remove and re-install the
>> wheels. Ant they cannot inspect it and find other chargeable items.
>> Thanks for the java.
>>
>>
>
>Actually, that was one of the points of confusion. Since I want the old
>tire back they had to figure out what to do about the "tire recycling fee".
>Kept'em busy, I did. Pushing the envelope, yep, that's me okay.

Tire tax is on the new one. The guys an idiot for not knowing that.
All tires end up recycled at some time.

This is entertaining. I'm starting to realize that our dealership is a
bit unusual. We actually try to know what we're doing.

Re: Somehow this confused the HD dealership...

Stingy Bastard wrote:
> All I wanted is to have new tires on my wheels. It's a '75 FLH. I brought
> in the loose wheels. For tires. Is this hard? Have a drink, I got
> pitchers of beer, apple cider and some egg nog, anything else ask Shirley

I love eggnog!

> and I'd stay away from the egg nog, it smells funny.

Uhhh...nevermind then. Ew. Can I have a vat o' margaritas? It's winter
here again. :-(

<snipthesordidtale>

> When I got home I warned The Wife that the dealership will be calling, and
> to just say, "Dunlop." See, they never asked that part.

I'm convinced that the only thing they know is what they can see on the
screen of the computer and if you throw them a curve the makes their
little brains explode.

That's why I go to my friend with the independent shop now. AND he
doesn't mind it when I call him and say, "did I remove 2 or 3 wires from
that starter? I'm only finding 2 now to connect to the new one..." 8-)

--
Donna A.
Wench #17/Bitch #17/BS #26/AH#107/SLOB #9
'95 FLHTCUI Fuel Injected 30th Anniversary Electraglide "Fueley"
'66 H-D Bobcat "Baby Blue"--Harley Hummer Club Member #1066
http :// spoiled-brat,com

Re: Somehow this confused the HD dealership...

Donna A. wrote:
> Stingy Bastard wrote:
>> All I wanted is to have new tires on my wheels. It's a '75 FLH. I
>> brought in the loose wheels. For tires. Is this hard? Have a
>> drink, I got pitchers of beer, apple cider and some egg nog,
>> anything else ask Shirley
>
> I love eggnog!
>
>> and I'd stay away from the egg nog, it smells funny.
>
> Uhhh...nevermind then. Ew. Can I have a vat o' margaritas? It's winter
> here again. :-(
>
> <snipthesordidtale>
>
>> When I got home I warned The Wife that the dealership will be
>> calling, and to just say, "Dunlop." See, they never asked that part.
>
> I'm convinced that the only thing they know is what they can see on
> the screen of the computer and if you throw them a curve the makes
> their little brains explode.
>
> That's why I go to my friend with the independent shop now. AND he
> doesn't mind it when I call him and say, "did I remove 2 or 3 wires
> from that starter? I'm only finding 2 now to connect to the new
> one..." 8-)

Y'all need to find better dealers . I walk into the local , the parts
counter folks all know me by name and know what I ride . The receptionist
doesn't know my name , but she does know my ugly mug .
--
Snag
'90 Ultra "Strider"
'39 WLDD "Popcycle"
Buncha cars and a truck

Re: Somehow this confused the HD dealership...

"Terry Coombs" <snagone@bellsouth,net > wrote in message
news:ap1Rj.55644$Q52.55383@bignews9.bellsouth,net ...
> Donna A. wrote:
>> Stingy Bastard wrote:
>>> All I wanted is to have new tires on my wheels. It's a '75 FLH. I
>>> brought in the loose wheels. For tires. Is this hard? Have a
>>> drink, I got pitchers of beer, apple cider and some egg nog,
>>> anything else ask Shirley
>>
>> I love eggnog!
>>
>>> and I'd stay away from the egg nog, it smells funny.
>>
>> Uhhh...nevermind then. Ew. Can I have a vat o' margaritas? It's winter
>> here again. :-(
>>
>> <snipthesordidtale>
>>
>>> When I got home I warned The Wife that the dealership will be
>>> calling, and to just say, "Dunlop." See, they never asked that part.
>>
>> I'm convinced that the only thing they know is what they can see on
>> the screen of the computer and if you throw them a curve the makes
>> their little brains explode.
>>
>> That's why I go to my friend with the independent shop now. AND he
>> doesn't mind it when I call him and say, "did I remove 2 or 3 wires
>> from that starter? I'm only finding 2 now to connect to the new
>> one..." 8-)
>
> Y'all need to find better dealers . I walk into the local , the parts
> counter folks all know me by name and know what I ride . The receptionist
> doesn't know my name , but she does know my ugly mug .
> --
> Snag
> '90 Ultra "Strider"
> '39 WLDD "Popcycle"
> Buncha cars and a truck
>

I got a local Indy that's a great help, but for skins I'd rather go where
there's a lot of churn in the stock, I don't want seven year old tires that
have been waiting for a buyer, y'know?

--
Don
Concede to idiot cagers. Right of Way is irrelevant during the collision.
No bozo to reply