How many volumn of solution do I need to smoothly process print paper in a 12x16 tray?

On Apr 30, 1:04 am, Peter <w2...@hotmail . com > wrote:
>
> A problem that occurs when trying to use the minimum
> developer is initially wetting the paper evenly.
>

Pre-wetting the paper is another way when using minimal
solution volumes. A minute or two will do. Pour out the water,
pour in the developer. I process using one-shot very dilute,
developer and fix, no stop. My solution volumes are the
surface area of the paper in square inches times four
equals the volume in ml. Likely three times would
still provide easy processing; eg, 8x10, 240ml -
12x16, 576ml

A second tray is used for holding. The processing and
hold trays are used for alternate tray washing. Dan

On May 4, 7:31 am, dan.c.qu...@att . net wrote:
> On Apr 30, 1:04 am, Peter <w2...@hotmail . com > wrote:
>
>
>
> > A problem that occurs when trying to use the minimum
> > developer is initially wetting the paper evenly.
>
> Pre-wetting the paper is another way when using minimal
> solution volumes. A minute or two will do. Pour out the water,
> pour in the developer. I process using one-shot very dilute,
> developer and fix, no stop. My solution volumes are the
> surface area of the paper in square inches times four
> equals the volume in ml. Likely three times would
> still provide easy processing; eg, 8x10, 240ml -
> 12x16, 576ml
>
> A second tray is used for holding. The processing and
> hold trays are used for alternate tray washing. Dan

that means you use 50 mm heigth of solution.

On May 4, 9:31 am, Steven Woody <narkewo...@gmail . com > wrote:
> On May 4, 7:31 am, dan.c.qu...@att . net wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Apr 30, 1:04 am, Peter <w2...@hotmail . com > wrote:
>
> > > A problem that occurs when trying to use the minimum
> > > developer is initially wetting the paper evenly.
>
> > Pre-wetting the paper is another way when using minimal
> > solution volumes. A minute or two will do. Pour out the water,
> > pour in the developer. I process using one-shot very dilute,
> > developer and fix, no stop. My solution volumes are the
> > surface area of the paper in square inches times four
> > equals the volume in ml. Likely three times would
> > still provide easy processing; eg, 8x10, 240ml -
> > 12x16, 576ml
>
> > A second tray is used for holding. The processing and
> > hold trays are used for alternate tray washing. Dan
>
> that means you use 50 mm heigth of solution.

sorry, typo. i meant to say 5mm.

In article <c12fd450-b75d-4e96-afa3-1a72e694040b@q1g2000prf.googlegroups . com >,
<dan.c.quinn@att . net > wrote:
>On Apr 30, 1:04 am, Peter <w2...@hotmail . com > wrote:
>>
>> A problem that occurs when trying to use the minimum
>> developer is initially wetting the paper evenly.
>>
>
>Pre-wetting the paper is another way when using minimal
>solution volumes. A minute or two will do. Pour out the water,
>pour in the developer.

This is a very bad idea, as a general-purpose development technique --
it will dramatically change the characteristic curve of the paper, or,
at least, the papers I was using when I tried it (Kodabromide III,
and the last-generation Oriental-manufactured Seagull the second time I
gave it a shot) exhibited this effect unless given extremely long
development times.

--
Thor Lancelot Simon tls@rek.tjls . com

"The inconsistency is startling, though admittedly, if consistency is to
be abandoned or transcended, there is no problem." - Noam Chomsky

On May 4, 10:00 am, t...@panix . com (Thor Lancelot Simon) wrote:
>
>  <dan.c.qu...@att . net > wrote:
>
> >Pre-wetting the paper is another way when using minimal
> >solution volumes. A minute or two will do. Pour out the water,
> >pour in the developer.
>
> This is a very bad idea, as a general-purpose development
> technique -- it will dramatically change the characteristic curve
> of the paper, or, at least, the papers I was using when I tried it
> Thor Lancelot Simon
>

I'd suppose the same could be said for pre-wetted film although
I've never heard it mentioned. In both instances one might think of
pre-wetting as water bath development but with one pre-development
bath. Perhaps my use of very dilute one-shot developer and some
what extended development times preclude the effect.
Usually I've enough solution volume so skip pre-wetting. IMO, one
wetting couldn't possibly make any more than an insignificant
difference; taking into account my very watery developer.
I will though look out for pre-wet effects. Dan

Some paper has developer in the emulsion coating. Wouldn't it be washed out
with pre-soaking?

On 5/4/2008 6:24 PM Pico spake thus:

> Some paper has developer in the emulsion coating. Wouldn't it be washed out
> with pre-soaking?

It would be activated, not washed out. No doubt one of the things that
contributes to the ill effects Thor commented on.


--
The best argument against democracy is a five-minute
conversation with the average voter.

- Attributed to Winston Churchill

On May 4, 6:39 pm, David Nebenzahl wrote:
>
> On 5/4/2008 6:24 PM Pico spake thus:
>
> > Some paper has developer in the emulsion coating. Wouldn't
> > it be washed out with pre-soaking?
>
> It would be activated, not washed out. No doubt one of the
> things that contributes to the ill effects Thor commented on.
>

Two points: First; papers with developer incorporated are
intended for ACTIVATOR processing. Thay can be processed
in a bath of sodium carbonate. Second; just try and find a paper
with developer incorporated. Over the years I've tested well over
a half dozen, VC RC, Graded RC, VC FB, Graded FB, and
found NONE.

In a word, for most purposes developer incorporate papers
are NON-EXISTANT. Dan

<dan.c.quinn@att . net > wrote in message
news:9692facd-dd97-42f7-a790-31943423c3f1@h1g2000prh.googlegroups . com ...
On May 4, 6:39 pm, David Nebenzahl wrote:

> [...] In a word, for most purposes developer incorporate papers are
> NON-EXISTANT.

Dan - that's great news and very much appreciated.

"Steven Woody" <narkewoody@gmail . com > wrote in message
news:cc2e6d67-59d8-46e6-8a0f-44dddcd9271d@l28g2000prd.googlegroups . com ...
> How many volumn of solution do I need at least to smoothly process
> print paper in a 12x16 tray? I am afraid my 2 liter bottle is not
> enough to do this. Thanks.

Two liters should do even if it represents the diluted solution. If your
concern is the capacity of the solution, how many prints you can make with
it, then we need to know the developer in use. Fresh developer, of course.
Stop (if you use it) and fixers (2 baths) will work. It's best in a
situation with little solution to use a tray that has a flat bottom, or
minimal expressions. Take care not to let the paper get 'stuck' to the
bottom. (Stiction to be technical.)

Drifting a bit - I was lucky to have aquired several NIB 8"x10" curved
(commonly called 'canoe' shaped) stainless trays intended for processing
color paper. They are stainless in part to conduct heat, but they clean up
nicely too. They won't fit your paper unless you were speaking of
centimeters. They permit the use of very little chemistry. One 'rocks' the
tray on it's curved bottom. I use them for sheet film. One-shot chemistry.

In article
<cc2e6d67-59d8-46e6-8a0f-44dddcd9271d@l28g2000prd.googlegroups . com >,
Steven Woody <narkewoody@gmail . com > wrote:

> How many volumn of solution do I need at least to smoothly process
> print paper in a 12x16 tray? I am afraid my 2 liter bottle is not
> enough to do this. Thanks.
>
> -
> woody

2 liters is easily enough but it depends how many sheets. One liter
should be adequate for about 25 B&W FB based prints in an 11x14 tray.

--
Reality is a picture perfected and never looking back.