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Vitamin supplements 'do us no good and may be harmful'
Vitamin supplements 'do us no good and may be harmful'
http :// www .independent.co.uk/life-style/health-and-wellbeing/health-news/vitamin-supplements-do-us-no-good-and-may-be-harmful-809607.html
Brief snip:
Vitamin supplements 'do us no good and may be harmful'
By Jeremy Laurance, Health Editor
Wednesday, 16 April 2008
We swallow them by the bucketload at great expense but there
is no evidence vitamin supplements do us any good, and they
may even be doing us harm, scientists have concluded. In a
blow to the multimillion pound dietary supplement industry,
a review of 67 randomised trials of vitamin pills has found
that far from prolonging life, they may actually shorten it.
<snip>
http :// www .independent.co.uk/life-style/health-and-wellbeing/health-news/vitamin-supplements-do-us-no-good-and-may-be-harmful-809607.html
Brief snip:
Vitamin supplements 'do us no good and may be harmful'
By Jeremy Laurance, Health Editor
Wednesday, 16 April 2008
We swallow them by the bucketload at great expense but there
is no evidence vitamin supplements do us any good, and they
may even be doing us harm, scientists have concluded. In a
blow to the multimillion pound dietary supplement industry,
a review of 67 randomised trials of vitamin pills has found
that far from prolonging life, they may actually shorten it.
<snip>
Re: Vitamin supplements 'do us no good and may be harmful'
On Apr 15, 11:08 pm, valhealey <jvhea...@sbcglobal,net > wrote:
> http :// www .independent.co.uk/life-style/health-and-wellbeing/health-n...
>
> Brief snip:
>
> Vitamin supplements 'do us no good and may be harmful'
>
> By Jeremy Laurance, Health Editor
> Wednesday, 16 April 2008
>
> We swallow them by the bucketload at great expense but there
> is no evidence vitamin supplements do us any good, and they
> may even be doing us harm, scientists have concluded. In a
> blow to the multimillion pound dietary supplement industry,
> a review of 67 randomised trials of vitamin pills has found
> that far from prolonging life, they may actually shorten it.
> <snip>
These clowns wouldn't know evidence if it bit they in the arse.
A review based of poorly run trials results in poor conclusions.
The best thing one can do is to boycott items or services
that purchase adverts in the so-called "Independent."
On Apr 15, 11:08 pm, valhealey <jvhea...@sbcglobal,net > wrote:
> http :// www .independent.co.uk/life-style/health-and-wellbeing/health-n...
>
> Brief snip:
>
> Vitamin supplements 'do us no good and may be harmful'
>
> By Jeremy Laurance, Health Editor
> Wednesday, 16 April 2008
>
> We swallow them by the bucketload at great expense but there
> is no evidence vitamin supplements do us any good, and they
> may even be doing us harm, scientists have concluded. In a
> blow to the multimillion pound dietary supplement industry,
> a review of 67 randomised trials of vitamin pills has found
> that far from prolonging life, they may actually shorten it.
> <snip>
These clowns wouldn't know evidence if it bit they in the arse.
A review based of poorly run trials results in poor conclusions.
The best thing one can do is to boycott items or services
that purchase adverts in the so-called "Independent."
Re: Vitamin supplements 'do us no good and may be harmful'
<trigonometry1972@gmail,com > wrote in message
news:dd72323a-9dca-480f-81b4-8ab3d88c576c@26g2000hsk.googlegroups,com ...
On Apr 15, 11:08 pm, valhealey <jvhea...@sbcglobal,net > wrote:
> http :// www .independent.co.uk/life-style/health-and-wellbeing/health-n...
>
> Brief snip:
>
> Vitamin supplements 'do us no good and may be harmful'
>
> By Jeremy Laurance, Health Editor
> Wednesday, 16 April 2008
>
> We swallow them by the bucketload at great expense but there
> is no evidence vitamin supplements do us any good, and they
> may even be doing us harm, scientists have concluded. In a
> blow to the multimillion pound dietary supplement industry,
> a review of 67 randomised trials of vitamin pills has found
> that far from prolonging life, they may actually shorten it.
> <snip>
These clowns wouldn't know evidence if it bit they in the arse.
A review based of poorly run trials results in poor conclusions.
The best thing one can do is to boycott items or services
that purchase adverts in the so-called "Independent."
Carole > They're just a pack of clowns who wouldn't know what day it was.
Its just amazing how these "experts" know so little about so much.
Carole
www .cellsalts,net
<trigonometry1972@gmail,com > wrote in message
news:dd72323a-9dca-480f-81b4-8ab3d88c576c@26g2000hsk.googlegroups,com ...
On Apr 15, 11:08 pm, valhealey <jvhea...@sbcglobal,net > wrote:
> http :// www .independent.co.uk/life-style/health-and-wellbeing/health-n...
>
> Brief snip:
>
> Vitamin supplements 'do us no good and may be harmful'
>
> By Jeremy Laurance, Health Editor
> Wednesday, 16 April 2008
>
> We swallow them by the bucketload at great expense but there
> is no evidence vitamin supplements do us any good, and they
> may even be doing us harm, scientists have concluded. In a
> blow to the multimillion pound dietary supplement industry,
> a review of 67 randomised trials of vitamin pills has found
> that far from prolonging life, they may actually shorten it.
> <snip>
These clowns wouldn't know evidence if it bit they in the arse.
A review based of poorly run trials results in poor conclusions.
The best thing one can do is to boycott items or services
that purchase adverts in the so-called "Independent."
Carole > They're just a pack of clowns who wouldn't know what day it was.
Its just amazing how these "experts" know so little about so much.
Carole
www .cellsalts,net
Re: Vitamin supplements 'do us no good and may be harmful'
Here is the actual study referred to in the article:
http :// www .cochrane.org/reviews/en/ab007176.html
Here is the actual study referred to in the article:
http :// www .cochrane.org/reviews/en/ab007176.html
Re: Vitamin supplements 'do us no good and may be harmful'
"run_a_monk" <ajaydada@gmail,com > wrote in message
news:21c8932b-32c5-48c4-8933-505430f46dc7@8g2000hsu.googlegroups,com ...
> Here is the actual study referred to in the article:
>
> http :// www .cochrane.org/reviews/en/ab007176.html
What, you're saying the study is legitimate, therefore vitamins are useless?
Get a grip.
Merck did studies for their Vioxx.
These studies are engineered to produce the outcome they want.
Carole
www .cellsalts,net
"run_a_monk" <ajaydada@gmail,com > wrote in message
news:21c8932b-32c5-48c4-8933-505430f46dc7@8g2000hsu.googlegroups,com ...
> Here is the actual study referred to in the article:
>
> http :// www .cochrane.org/reviews/en/ab007176.html
What, you're saying the study is legitimate, therefore vitamins are useless?
Get a grip.
Merck did studies for their Vioxx.
These studies are engineered to produce the outcome they want.
Carole
www .cellsalts,net
Re: Vitamin supplements 'do us no good and may be harmful'
run a monk wrote:
> Here is the actual study referred to in the article:
>
> http :// www .cochrane.org/reviews/en/ab007176.html
They say,
"We found no evidence to support antioxidant supplements for primary
or secondary prevention. Vitamin A, beta-carotene, and vitamin E may
increase mortality."
But they didn't say they'd *found evidence* of the latter (that those
vitamins actually do increase mortality), just that they "may," without
explaining why they say so.
So is this newsworthy? Three authors did a meta-analysis and didn't
find evidence of anything, but they do advise the world that more
research is needed, and for the full article, they want money.
--
Marshall Price of Miami
Known to Yahoo as d021317c
run a monk wrote:
> Here is the actual study referred to in the article:
>
> http :// www .cochrane.org/reviews/en/ab007176.html
They say,
"We found no evidence to support antioxidant supplements for primary
or secondary prevention. Vitamin A, beta-carotene, and vitamin E may
increase mortality."
But they didn't say they'd *found evidence* of the latter (that those
vitamins actually do increase mortality), just that they "may," without
explaining why they say so.
So is this newsworthy? Three authors did a meta-analysis and didn't
find evidence of anything, but they do advise the world that more
research is needed, and for the full article, they want money.
--
Marshall Price of Miami
Known to Yahoo as d021317c
Re: Vitamin supplements 'do us no good and may be harmful'
In message <pMadnY7ipq0mrInVnZ2dnUVZ jqdnZ2d@earthlink,com >, Marshall Price wrote:
> So is this newsworthy? Three authors did a meta-analysis and didn't
> find evidence of anything, but they do advise the world that more
> research is needed, and for the full article, they want money.
One of the ugly aspects of academic publishing is that in
order to get their work published, the authors have to
sign over copyright. They don't get a dime from reprints,
and in fact can't even reprint their own work for classes
or on their websites.
--
| Shit happens. Sometimes it happens to you. |
+--- D. C. Sessions <dcs@lumbercartel,com > ---+
In message <pMadnY7ipq0mrInVnZ2dnUVZ jqdnZ2d@earthlink,com >, Marshall Price wrote:
> So is this newsworthy? Three authors did a meta-analysis and didn't
> find evidence of anything, but they do advise the world that more
> research is needed, and for the full article, they want money.
One of the ugly aspects of academic publishing is that in
order to get their work published, the authors have to
sign over copyright. They don't get a dime from reprints,
and in fact can't even reprint their own work for classes
or on their websites.
--
| Shit happens. Sometimes it happens to you. |
+--- D. C. Sessions <dcs@lumbercartel,com > ---+
Re: Vitamin supplements 'do us no good and may be harmful'
On Apr 27, 6:04 am, "D. C. Sessions" <d...@lumbercartel,com > wrote:
> In message <pMadnY7ipq0mrInVnZ2dnUVZ jqdn...@earthlink,com >, Marshall Price wrote:
>
> > So is this newsworthy? Three authors did a meta-analysis and didn't
> > find evidence of anything, but they do advise the world that more
> > research is needed, and for the full article, they want money.
>
> One of the ugly aspects of academic publishing is that in
> order to get their work published, the authors have to
> sign over copyright. They don't get a dime from reprints,
> and in fact can't even reprint their own work for classes
> or on their websites.
>
> --
> | Shit happens. Sometimes it happens to you. |
> +--- D. C. Sessions <d...@lumbercartel,com > ---+
It better to publish in a journal that frees up the articles
after a year or choose an free e-journal. I'd say each
University should have its own it e-journals for it
professors with later maintaining some connection
to the articles with them retaining some rights of use,
rights to edit and improve, so on.
On Apr 27, 6:04 am, "D. C. Sessions" <d...@lumbercartel,com > wrote:
> In message <pMadnY7ipq0mrInVnZ2dnUVZ jqdn...@earthlink,com >, Marshall Price wrote:
>
> > So is this newsworthy? Three authors did a meta-analysis and didn't
> > find evidence of anything, but they do advise the world that more
> > research is needed, and for the full article, they want money.
>
> One of the ugly aspects of academic publishing is that in
> order to get their work published, the authors have to
> sign over copyright. They don't get a dime from reprints,
> and in fact can't even reprint their own work for classes
> or on their websites.
>
> --
> | Shit happens. Sometimes it happens to you. |
> +--- D. C. Sessions <d...@lumbercartel,com > ---+
It better to publish in a journal that frees up the articles
after a year or choose an free e-journal. I'd say each
University should have its own it e-journals for it
professors with later maintaining some connection
to the articles with them retaining some rights of use,
rights to edit and improve, so on.
Re: Vitamin supplements 'do us no good and may be harmful'
D. C. Sessions wrote:
> In message <pMadnY7ipq0mrInVnZ2dnUVZ jqdnZ2d@earthlink,com >, Marshall Price wrote:
>
>> So is this newsworthy? Three authors did a meta-analysis and didn't
>> find evidence of anything, but they do advise the world that more
>> research is needed, and for the full article, they want money.
>
> One of the ugly aspects of academic publishing is that in
> order to get their work published, the authors have to
> sign over copyright. They don't get a dime from reprints,
> and in fact can't even reprint their own work for classes
> or on their websites.
>
That might be changing soon. I think it's "Physics Review Letters"
(maybe not) which is reconsidering its policies right now.
--
Marshall Price of Miami
Known to Yahoo as d021317c
D. C. Sessions wrote:
> In message <pMadnY7ipq0mrInVnZ2dnUVZ jqdnZ2d@earthlink,com >, Marshall Price wrote:
>
>> So is this newsworthy? Three authors did a meta-analysis and didn't
>> find evidence of anything, but they do advise the world that more
>> research is needed, and for the full article, they want money.
>
> One of the ugly aspects of academic publishing is that in
> order to get their work published, the authors have to
> sign over copyright. They don't get a dime from reprints,
> and in fact can't even reprint their own work for classes
> or on their websites.
>
That might be changing soon. I think it's "Physics Review Letters"
(maybe not) which is reconsidering its policies right now.
--
Marshall Price of Miami
Known to Yahoo as d021317c
Re: Vitamin supplements 'do us no good and may be harmful'
"trigonometry1972@gmail,com |" wrote:
>
> On Apr 15, 11:08 pm, valhealey <jvhea...@sbcglobal,net > wrote:
> > http :// www .independent.co.uk/life-style/health-and-wellbeing/health-n...
> >
> > Brief snip:
> >
> > Vitamin supplements 'do us no good and may be harmful'
> >
> > By Jeremy Laurance, Health Editor
> > Wednesday, 16 April 2008
> >
> > We swallow them by the bucketload at great expense but there
> > is no evidence vitamin supplements do us any good, and they
> > may even be doing us harm, scientists have concluded. In a
> > blow to the multimillion pound dietary supplement industry,
> > a review of 67 randomised trials of vitamin pills has found
> > that far from prolonging life, they may actually shorten it.
> > <snip>
>
> These clowns wouldn't know evidence if it bit they in the arse.
> A review based of poorly run trials results in poor conclusions.
That's why they reviewed 67 trials -- to average out
any particular studies with poor methodology.
A study isn't bad just because it reaches a conclusion
you don't like. Science often reveals information
that is surprising or disturbing.
If you disagree about that, please explain what error
was consistently being made in these 67 studies.
Reaching a conclusion you disagree with is not
an error.
"trigonometry1972@gmail,com |" wrote:
>
> On Apr 15, 11:08 pm, valhealey <jvhea...@sbcglobal,net > wrote:
> > http :// www .independent.co.uk/life-style/health-and-wellbeing/health-n...
> >
> > Brief snip:
> >
> > Vitamin supplements 'do us no good and may be harmful'
> >
> > By Jeremy Laurance, Health Editor
> > Wednesday, 16 April 2008
> >
> > We swallow them by the bucketload at great expense but there
> > is no evidence vitamin supplements do us any good, and they
> > may even be doing us harm, scientists have concluded. In a
> > blow to the multimillion pound dietary supplement industry,
> > a review of 67 randomised trials of vitamin pills has found
> > that far from prolonging life, they may actually shorten it.
> > <snip>
>
> These clowns wouldn't know evidence if it bit they in the arse.
> A review based of poorly run trials results in poor conclusions.
That's why they reviewed 67 trials -- to average out
any particular studies with poor methodology.
A study isn't bad just because it reaches a conclusion
you don't like. Science often reveals information
that is surprising or disturbing.
If you disagree about that, please explain what error
was consistently being made in these 67 studies.
Reaching a conclusion you disagree with is not
an error.
Re: Vitamin supplements 'do us no good and may be harmful'
On Apr 16, 10:10 am, Mark Thorson <nos...@sonic,net > wrote:
> "trigonometry1...@gmail,com |" wrote:
>
> > On Apr 15, 11:08 pm, valhealey <jvhea...@sbcglobal,net > wrote:
> > > http :// www .independent.co.uk/life-style/health-and-wellbeing/health-n...
>
> > > Brief snip:
>
> > > Vitamin supplements 'do us no good and may be harmful'
>
> > > By Jeremy Laurance, Health Editor
> > > Wednesday, 16 April 2008
>
> > > We swallow them by the bucketload at great expense but there
> > > is no evidence vitamin supplements do us any good, and they
> > > may even be doing us harm, scientists have concluded. In a
> > > blow to the multimillion pound dietary supplement industry,
> > > a review of 67 randomised trials of vitamin pills has found
> > > that far from prolonging life, they may actually shorten it.
> > > <snip>
>
> > These clowns wouldn't know evidence if it bit they in the arse.
> > A review based of poorly run trials results in poor conclusions.
>
> That's why they reviewed 67 trials -- to average out
> any particular studies with poor methodology.
>
> A study isn't bad just because it reaches a conclusion
> you don't like. Science often reveals information
> that is surprising or disturbing.
>
> If you disagree about that, please explain what error
> was consistently being made in these 67 studies.
> Reaching a conclusion you disagree with is not
> an error.
This is a rehashed/republished meta-analysis that hand picks 67
out of some 7 or 8 hundred studies to reach to the
conclusion they want. It is a meaningless editoral,
the morons in the press seem think of as science.
Nor do we see any discussion of confidence intervals
and significant figures.
On Apr 16, 10:10 am, Mark Thorson <nos...@sonic,net > wrote:
> "trigonometry1...@gmail,com |" wrote:
>
> > On Apr 15, 11:08 pm, valhealey <jvhea...@sbcglobal,net > wrote:
> > > http :// www .independent.co.uk/life-style/health-and-wellbeing/health-n...
>
> > > Brief snip:
>
> > > Vitamin supplements 'do us no good and may be harmful'
>
> > > By Jeremy Laurance, Health Editor
> > > Wednesday, 16 April 2008
>
> > > We swallow them by the bucketload at great expense but there
> > > is no evidence vitamin supplements do us any good, and they
> > > may even be doing us harm, scientists have concluded. In a
> > > blow to the multimillion pound dietary supplement industry,
> > > a review of 67 randomised trials of vitamin pills has found
> > > that far from prolonging life, they may actually shorten it.
> > > <snip>
>
> > These clowns wouldn't know evidence if it bit they in the arse.
> > A review based of poorly run trials results in poor conclusions.
>
> That's why they reviewed 67 trials -- to average out
> any particular studies with poor methodology.
>
> A study isn't bad just because it reaches a conclusion
> you don't like. Science often reveals information
> that is surprising or disturbing.
>
> If you disagree about that, please explain what error
> was consistently being made in these 67 studies.
> Reaching a conclusion you disagree with is not
> an error.
This is a rehashed/republished meta-analysis that hand picks 67
out of some 7 or 8 hundred studies to reach to the
conclusion they want. It is a meaningless editoral,
the morons in the press seem think of as science.
Nor do we see any discussion of confidence intervals
and significant figures.
Re: Vitamin supplements 'do us no good and may be harmful'
Maybe they say they do not work, but when I take them, I have more energy.
"valhealey" <jvhealey@sbcglobal,net > wrote in message
news:66ljcuF2li84rU1@mid.individual,net ...
> http :// www .independent.co.uk/life-style/health-and-wellbeing/health-news/vitamin-supplements-do-us-no-good-and-may-be-harmful-809607.html
>
>
> Brief snip:
>
> Vitamin supplements 'do us no good and may be harmful'
>
> By Jeremy Laurance, Health Editor
> Wednesday, 16 April 2008
>
> We swallow them by the bucketload at great expense but there is no
> evidence vitamin supplements do us any good, and they may even be doing us
> harm, scientists have concluded. In a blow to the multimillion pound
> dietary supplement industry, a review of 67 randomised trials of vitamin
> pills has found that far from prolonging life, they may actually shorten
> it. <snip>
Maybe they say they do not work, but when I take them, I have more energy.
"valhealey" <jvhealey@sbcglobal,net > wrote in message
news:66ljcuF2li84rU1@mid.individual,net ...
> http :// www .independent.co.uk/life-style/health-and-wellbeing/health-news/vitamin-supplements-do-us-no-good-and-may-be-harmful-809607.html
>
>
> Brief snip:
>
> Vitamin supplements 'do us no good and may be harmful'
>
> By Jeremy Laurance, Health Editor
> Wednesday, 16 April 2008
>
> We swallow them by the bucketload at great expense but there is no
> evidence vitamin supplements do us any good, and they may even be doing us
> harm, scientists have concluded. In a blow to the multimillion pound
> dietary supplement industry, a review of 67 randomised trials of vitamin
> pills has found that far from prolonging life, they may actually shorten
> it. <snip>
Re: Vitamin supplements 'do us no good and may be harmful'
lettich52 wrote:
> Maybe they say they do not work, but when I take them, I have more energy.
>
> "valhealey" <jvhealey@sbcglobal,net > wrote in message
> news:66ljcuF2li84rU1@mid.individual,net ...
>> http :// www .independent.co.uk/life-style/health-and-wellbeing/health-news/vitamin-supplements-do-us-no-good-and-may-be-harmful-809607.html
>>
>>
>> Brief snip:
>>
>> Vitamin supplements 'do us no good and may be harmful'
>>
>> By Jeremy Laurance, Health Editor
>> Wednesday, 16 April 2008
>>
>> We swallow them by the bucketload at great expense but there is no
>> evidence vitamin supplements do us any good, and they may even be doing us
>> harm, scientists have concluded. In a blow to the multimillion pound
>> dietary supplement industry, a review of 67 randomised trials of vitamin
>> pills has found that far from prolonging life, they may actually shorten
>> it. <snip>
Great response everyone :-)
I bet those "researchers" will be visiting the soup kitchens
soon.
RuF
lettich52 wrote:
> Maybe they say they do not work, but when I take them, I have more energy.
>
> "valhealey" <jvhealey@sbcglobal,net > wrote in message
> news:66ljcuF2li84rU1@mid.individual,net ...
>> http :// www .independent.co.uk/life-style/health-and-wellbeing/health-news/vitamin-supplements-do-us-no-good-and-may-be-harmful-809607.html
>>
>>
>> Brief snip:
>>
>> Vitamin supplements 'do us no good and may be harmful'
>>
>> By Jeremy Laurance, Health Editor
>> Wednesday, 16 April 2008
>>
>> We swallow them by the bucketload at great expense but there is no
>> evidence vitamin supplements do us any good, and they may even be doing us
>> harm, scientists have concluded. In a blow to the multimillion pound
>> dietary supplement industry, a review of 67 randomised trials of vitamin
>> pills has found that far from prolonging life, they may actually shorten
>> it. <snip>
Great response everyone :-)
I bet those "researchers" will be visiting the soup kitchens
soon.
RuF
Re: Vitamin supplements 'do us no good and may be harmful'
lettich52 wrote:
>
> Maybe they say they do not work, but when I take them, I have more energy.
Likely a placebo effect. Feelings of "energy"
are not associated with any vitamin, unlike
something like candy bars which directly
contribute toward blood sugar.
lettich52 wrote:
>
> Maybe they say they do not work, but when I take them, I have more energy.
Likely a placebo effect. Feelings of "energy"
are not associated with any vitamin, unlike
something like candy bars which directly
contribute toward blood sugar.
Re: Vitamin supplements 'do us no good and may be harmful'
Mark Thorson wrote:
> lettich52 wrote:
>> Maybe they say they do not work, but when I take them, I have more energy.
>
> Likely a placebo effect. Feelings of "energy"
> are not associated with any vitamin, unlike
> something like candy bars which directly
> contribute toward blood sugar.
That depends on how much you need them -- and at least two vitamins
(thiamine and cyanocobalamin) are generally considered "tonics," which
means they do make you feel like you have more energy.
--
Marshall Price of Miami
Known to Yahoo as d021317c
Mark Thorson wrote:
> lettich52 wrote:
>> Maybe they say they do not work, but when I take them, I have more energy.
>
> Likely a placebo effect. Feelings of "energy"
> are not associated with any vitamin, unlike
> something like candy bars which directly
> contribute toward blood sugar.
That depends on how much you need them -- and at least two vitamins
(thiamine and cyanocobalamin) are generally considered "tonics," which
means they do make you feel like you have more energy.
--
Marshall Price of Miami
Known to Yahoo as d021317c
