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Supplements for Neuropathy
Re: Supplements for Neuropathy
On Jun 2, 8:07 pm, Marshall Price <d0213...@yahoo,com > wrote:
> Kofi wrote:
> > In article
> > <739091c9-61a5-4257-844a-cbc2e72bd...@r66g2000hsg.googlegroups,com >,
> > jay <jaym1...@hotmail,com > wrote:
>
> >> What supplements provide relief from polyneuropathy? Would the
> >> following be the most important? Already doing paleo-type diet,
> >> moderate exercise and multi-vitamins.
>
> >> Benfotiamine
> >> Vitamin B6 (P-5-P)
> >> R-Lipoic Acid
> >> NAC
> >> Acetyl-L-Carnitine
>
> > I've had neuropathy too.
>
> > A couple of points:
>
> > + Stoke the GABA channel. Homocysteine blocks it, so anything that
> > lowers homocysteine should work - methyl-B12, folic acid, betaine, SAMe,
> > creatine, choline. (Insulin resistance interferes with GABA receptor
> > function, by the way.) You can boost GABA production per se with
> > magnesium, taurine and a few of the previously mentioned items.
> > Magnesium also antagonizes the actions of Substance P.
>
> > + Check for molybdenum deficiency, which is common in diabetes and
> > depresses metallothionein synthesis. Also check for metals poisoning
> > and other toxicities.
>
> > + Intermittent fasting - eat as much as you want the first day, then
> > fast the second day and repeat. Much easier than calorie restriction
> > and doesn't require expert nutritional supervision.
>
> > + Acetyl-l-carnitine upregulates the low affinity nerve growth factor
> > receptor (p75NGFR) - thus its limited ability to regrow peripheral
> > nerves. p75 accelerates growth in some cancers (e.g. gliomas) and
> > shrinks other cancers. Make sure you understand what ALCAR is doing to
> > your cancer risk. (A high enough dose should also send your hair
> > follicles into catagen.)
>
> > + Butyrate (~3g daily). It's an HDAC inhibitor produced in the gut
> > from fiber. It requires carnitine for absorption and metabolization.
> > Butyrate directly induces autophagy.
>
> > + If you're taking lipoic acid, take plenty of biotin.
>
> > + For pain relief, low-dose naltrexone blocks dependency, increases
> > analgesia and reduces tolerance/addiction when used in conjunction with
> > standard opioids.
>
> > + Green tea extract (analgesia via PPARalpha agonism, maybe PKC
> > inhibition).
>
> > + Atrial natriuretic factor (produced via certain types of heat stress).
>
> > + gluatmine (HO-1)
>
> > + Vitamin D3 (via HIF-1?).
>
> > + DHEA (like carnitine, it's a PKC inhibitor and thus raises the pain
> > threshold).
>
> > + Death of gut bacteria can lower the pain threshold [PMID 17159985].
>
> > + Cox-2 inhibitors can actually induce autoimmunity and sometimes
> > sensitize nerves to pain.
>
> Whew! That's a lot to absorb at one sitting.
>
> About acetyl-L-carnitine, you said:
>
> > A high enough dose should also send your hair
> > follicles into catagen.
>
> What does that mean? (I'm not familiar with the word "catagen.")
>
> --
> Marshall Price of Miami
> Known to Yahoo as d021317c
Catagen:the involutional phase of hair growth.
Compare meanings of the words anagen
and telogen.
Involutional: a normal process characterized by a decrease
in the size of an organ caused by a decrease in the size
of cells. The word has another use as well.
In short: the categen phase comes just before the rest phase and
then shedding.
On Jun 2, 8:07 pm, Marshall Price <d0213...@yahoo,com > wrote:
> Kofi wrote:
> > In article
> > <739091c9-61a5-4257-844a-cbc2e72bd...@r66g2000hsg.googlegroups,com >,
> > jay <jaym1...@hotmail,com > wrote:
>
> >> What supplements provide relief from polyneuropathy? Would the
> >> following be the most important? Already doing paleo-type diet,
> >> moderate exercise and multi-vitamins.
>
> >> Benfotiamine
> >> Vitamin B6 (P-5-P)
> >> R-Lipoic Acid
> >> NAC
> >> Acetyl-L-Carnitine
>
> > I've had neuropathy too.
>
> > A couple of points:
>
> > + Stoke the GABA channel. Homocysteine blocks it, so anything that
> > lowers homocysteine should work - methyl-B12, folic acid, betaine, SAMe,
> > creatine, choline. (Insulin resistance interferes with GABA receptor
> > function, by the way.) You can boost GABA production per se with
> > magnesium, taurine and a few of the previously mentioned items.
> > Magnesium also antagonizes the actions of Substance P.
>
> > + Check for molybdenum deficiency, which is common in diabetes and
> > depresses metallothionein synthesis. Also check for metals poisoning
> > and other toxicities.
>
> > + Intermittent fasting - eat as much as you want the first day, then
> > fast the second day and repeat. Much easier than calorie restriction
> > and doesn't require expert nutritional supervision.
>
> > + Acetyl-l-carnitine upregulates the low affinity nerve growth factor
> > receptor (p75NGFR) - thus its limited ability to regrow peripheral
> > nerves. p75 accelerates growth in some cancers (e.g. gliomas) and
> > shrinks other cancers. Make sure you understand what ALCAR is doing to
> > your cancer risk. (A high enough dose should also send your hair
> > follicles into catagen.)
>
> > + Butyrate (~3g daily). It's an HDAC inhibitor produced in the gut
> > from fiber. It requires carnitine for absorption and metabolization.
> > Butyrate directly induces autophagy.
>
> > + If you're taking lipoic acid, take plenty of biotin.
>
> > + For pain relief, low-dose naltrexone blocks dependency, increases
> > analgesia and reduces tolerance/addiction when used in conjunction with
> > standard opioids.
>
> > + Green tea extract (analgesia via PPARalpha agonism, maybe PKC
> > inhibition).
>
> > + Atrial natriuretic factor (produced via certain types of heat stress).
>
> > + gluatmine (HO-1)
>
> > + Vitamin D3 (via HIF-1?).
>
> > + DHEA (like carnitine, it's a PKC inhibitor and thus raises the pain
> > threshold).
>
> > + Death of gut bacteria can lower the pain threshold [PMID 17159985].
>
> > + Cox-2 inhibitors can actually induce autoimmunity and sometimes
> > sensitize nerves to pain.
>
> Whew! That's a lot to absorb at one sitting.
>
> About acetyl-L-carnitine, you said:
>
> > A high enough dose should also send your hair
> > follicles into catagen.
>
> What does that mean? (I'm not familiar with the word "catagen.")
>
> --
> Marshall Price of Miami
> Known to Yahoo as d021317c
Catagen:the involutional phase of hair growth.
Compare meanings of the words anagen
and telogen.
Involutional: a normal process characterized by a decrease
in the size of an organ caused by a decrease in the size
of cells. The word has another use as well.
In short: the categen phase comes just before the rest phase and
then shedding.
Re: Supplements for Neuropathy
trigonometry1972@gmail,com | wrote:
> On Jun 2, 8:07 pm, Marshall Price <d0213...@yahoo,com > wrote:
>> Kofi wrote:
>>> In article
>>> <739091c9-61a5-4257-844a-cbc2e72bd...@r66g2000hsg.googlegroups,com >,
>>> jay <jaym1...@hotmail,com > wrote:
>>>> What supplements provide relief from polyneuropathy? Would the
>>>> following be the most important? Already doing paleo-type diet,
>>>> moderate exercise and multi-vitamins.
>>>> Benfotiamine
>>>> Vitamin B6 (P-5-P)
>>>> R-Lipoic Acid
>>>> NAC
>>>> Acetyl-L-Carnitine
>>> I've had neuropathy too.
>>> A couple of points:
>>> + Stoke the GABA channel. Homocysteine blocks it, so anything that
>>> lowers homocysteine should work - methyl-B12, folic acid, betaine, SAMe,
>>> creatine, choline. (Insulin resistance interferes with GABA receptor
>>> function, by the way.) You can boost GABA production per se with
>>> magnesium, taurine and a few of the previously mentioned items.
>>> Magnesium also antagonizes the actions of Substance P.
>>> + Check for molybdenum deficiency, which is common in diabetes and
>>> depresses metallothionein synthesis. Also check for metals poisoning
>>> and other toxicities.
>>> + Intermittent fasting - eat as much as you want the first day, then
>>> fast the second day and repeat. Much easier than calorie restriction
>>> and doesn't require expert nutritional supervision.
>>> + Acetyl-l-carnitine upregulates the low affinity nerve growth factor
>>> receptor (p75NGFR) - thus its limited ability to regrow peripheral
>>> nerves. p75 accelerates growth in some cancers (e.g. gliomas) and
>>> shrinks other cancers. Make sure you understand what ALCAR is doing to
>>> your cancer risk. (A high enough dose should also send your hair
>>> follicles into catagen.)
>>> + Butyrate (~3g daily). It's an HDAC inhibitor produced in the gut
>>> from fiber. It requires carnitine for absorption and metabolization.
>>> Butyrate directly induces autophagy.
>>> + If you're taking lipoic acid, take plenty of biotin.
>>> + For pain relief, low-dose naltrexone blocks dependency, increases
>>> analgesia and reduces tolerance/addiction when used in conjunction with
>>> standard opioids.
>>> + Green tea extract (analgesia via PPARalpha agonism, maybe PKC
>>> inhibition).
>>> + Atrial natriuretic factor (produced via certain types of heat stress).
>>> + gluatmine (HO-1)
>>> + Vitamin D3 (via HIF-1?).
>>> + DHEA (like carnitine, it's a PKC inhibitor and thus raises the pain
>>> threshold).
>>> + Death of gut bacteria can lower the pain threshold [PMID 17159985].
>>> + Cox-2 inhibitors can actually induce autoimmunity and sometimes
>>> sensitize nerves to pain.
>> Whew! That's a lot to absorb at one sitting.
>>
>> About acetyl-L-carnitine, you said:
>>
>> > A high enough dose should also send your hair
>> > follicles into catagen.
>>
>> What does that mean? (I'm not familiar with the word "catagen.")
>
> Catagen:the involutional phase of hair growth.
> Compare meanings of the words anagen
> and telogen.
>
> Involutional: a normal process characterized by a decrease
> in the size of an organ caused by a decrease in the size
> of cells. The word has another use as well.
>
> In short: the categen phase comes just before the rest phase and
> then shedding.
Darn! It's in my medical dictionary. I *still* don't have the thing
memorized. ;-)
So why will acetyl-L-carnitine do that?
(I like it because it hides the brain damage. But hair hides the
skull damage, so it's hardly an easy decision to make!)
--
Marshall Price of Miami
Known to Yahoo as d021317c
trigonometry1972@gmail,com | wrote:
> On Jun 2, 8:07 pm, Marshall Price <d0213...@yahoo,com > wrote:
>> Kofi wrote:
>>> In article
>>> <739091c9-61a5-4257-844a-cbc2e72bd...@r66g2000hsg.googlegroups,com >,
>>> jay <jaym1...@hotmail,com > wrote:
>>>> What supplements provide relief from polyneuropathy? Would the
>>>> following be the most important? Already doing paleo-type diet,
>>>> moderate exercise and multi-vitamins.
>>>> Benfotiamine
>>>> Vitamin B6 (P-5-P)
>>>> R-Lipoic Acid
>>>> NAC
>>>> Acetyl-L-Carnitine
>>> I've had neuropathy too.
>>> A couple of points:
>>> + Stoke the GABA channel. Homocysteine blocks it, so anything that
>>> lowers homocysteine should work - methyl-B12, folic acid, betaine, SAMe,
>>> creatine, choline. (Insulin resistance interferes with GABA receptor
>>> function, by the way.) You can boost GABA production per se with
>>> magnesium, taurine and a few of the previously mentioned items.
>>> Magnesium also antagonizes the actions of Substance P.
>>> + Check for molybdenum deficiency, which is common in diabetes and
>>> depresses metallothionein synthesis. Also check for metals poisoning
>>> and other toxicities.
>>> + Intermittent fasting - eat as much as you want the first day, then
>>> fast the second day and repeat. Much easier than calorie restriction
>>> and doesn't require expert nutritional supervision.
>>> + Acetyl-l-carnitine upregulates the low affinity nerve growth factor
>>> receptor (p75NGFR) - thus its limited ability to regrow peripheral
>>> nerves. p75 accelerates growth in some cancers (e.g. gliomas) and
>>> shrinks other cancers. Make sure you understand what ALCAR is doing to
>>> your cancer risk. (A high enough dose should also send your hair
>>> follicles into catagen.)
>>> + Butyrate (~3g daily). It's an HDAC inhibitor produced in the gut
>>> from fiber. It requires carnitine for absorption and metabolization.
>>> Butyrate directly induces autophagy.
>>> + If you're taking lipoic acid, take plenty of biotin.
>>> + For pain relief, low-dose naltrexone blocks dependency, increases
>>> analgesia and reduces tolerance/addiction when used in conjunction with
>>> standard opioids.
>>> + Green tea extract (analgesia via PPARalpha agonism, maybe PKC
>>> inhibition).
>>> + Atrial natriuretic factor (produced via certain types of heat stress).
>>> + gluatmine (HO-1)
>>> + Vitamin D3 (via HIF-1?).
>>> + DHEA (like carnitine, it's a PKC inhibitor and thus raises the pain
>>> threshold).
>>> + Death of gut bacteria can lower the pain threshold [PMID 17159985].
>>> + Cox-2 inhibitors can actually induce autoimmunity and sometimes
>>> sensitize nerves to pain.
>> Whew! That's a lot to absorb at one sitting.
>>
>> About acetyl-L-carnitine, you said:
>>
>> > A high enough dose should also send your hair
>> > follicles into catagen.
>>
>> What does that mean? (I'm not familiar with the word "catagen.")
>
> Catagen:the involutional phase of hair growth.
> Compare meanings of the words anagen
> and telogen.
>
> Involutional: a normal process characterized by a decrease
> in the size of an organ caused by a decrease in the size
> of cells. The word has another use as well.
>
> In short: the categen phase comes just before the rest phase and
> then shedding.
Darn! It's in my medical dictionary. I *still* don't have the thing
memorized. ;-)
So why will acetyl-L-carnitine do that?
(I like it because it hides the brain damage. But hair hides the
skull damage, so it's hardly an easy decision to make!)
--
Marshall Price of Miami
Known to Yahoo as d021317c
Reply from: -- messaggio eliminato --
Date: 05 Jun 2008, 07:47
-- deleted messages --
Reply from: -- messaggio eliminato --
Date: 08 Jun 2008, 13:39
-- deleted messages --
Re: Supplements for Neuropathy
> About acetyl-L-carnitine, you said:
>
> > A high enough dose should also send your hair
> > follicles into catagen.
>
> What does that mean? (I'm not familiar with the word "catagen.")
It's the rest phase for hair follicles. They fall out and go dormant.
> About acetyl-L-carnitine, you said:
>
> > A high enough dose should also send your hair
> > follicles into catagen.
>
> What does that mean? (I'm not familiar with the word "catagen.")
It's the rest phase for hair follicles. They fall out and go dormant.
Re: Supplements for Neuropathy
> I've had neuropathy too.
Kofi, thanks for the exhaustive list.
> ....check for metals poisoning and other toxicities.
I had my mercury amalgams removed now almost 20 years ago. Not sure if
that was a factor.
> + Intermittent fasting
During short 12-hour fasts, I notice nerve pain/numbness subsides
considerably.
> + Butyrate (~3g daily).
Would eating psyllium produce similar results?
> + Green tea extract
Not sure, but tea seems to reduce my sciatica.
> + Atrial natriuretic factor (produced via certain types of heat stress).
Would hot showers work?
> I've had neuropathy too.
Kofi, thanks for the exhaustive list.
> ....check for metals poisoning and other toxicities.
I had my mercury amalgams removed now almost 20 years ago. Not sure if
that was a factor.
> + Intermittent fasting
During short 12-hour fasts, I notice nerve pain/numbness subsides
considerably.
> + Butyrate (~3g daily).
Would eating psyllium produce similar results?
> + Green tea extract
Not sure, but tea seems to reduce my sciatica.
> + Atrial natriuretic factor (produced via certain types of heat stress).
Would hot showers work?
Re: Supplements for Neuropathy
jay wrote:
>>+ Butyrate (~3g daily).
> Would eating psyllium produce similar results?
Psyllium can act as a prebiotic. Probiotics that increase the bacteria
that ferment fibers to produce short chain fatty acids including
butyrate might get this effect, but it depends on how bioavailable ~3
grams of butyrate is versus that produced in the lower digestive tract,
i.e., the distal ileum and proximal colon. Some yogurts include active
bacteria for this purpose.
A Scholar.Google search for the terms
butyrate+diabetic+neuropathy+human+clinical+trials -
http :// tinyurl,com /45a9bt.
Modulatory effect of butyric acid - a product of dietary fiber
fermentation in experimentally induced diabetic rats.PMID: 12231422
Frank
jay wrote:
>>+ Butyrate (~3g daily).
> Would eating psyllium produce similar results?
Psyllium can act as a prebiotic. Probiotics that increase the bacteria
that ferment fibers to produce short chain fatty acids including
butyrate might get this effect, but it depends on how bioavailable ~3
grams of butyrate is versus that produced in the lower digestive tract,
i.e., the distal ileum and proximal colon. Some yogurts include active
bacteria for this purpose.
A Scholar.Google search for the terms
butyrate+diabetic+neuropathy+human+clinical+trials -
http :// tinyurl,com /45a9bt.
Modulatory effect of butyric acid - a product of dietary fiber
fermentation in experimentally induced diabetic rats.PMID: 12231422
Frank
Re: Supplements for Neuropathy
> > ....check for metals poisoning and other toxicities.
>
> I had my mercury amalgams removed now almost 20 years ago. Not sure if
> that was a factor.
It can stay in bones and fat a long time. Since diabetics also have low
molybdenum levels, this affects metallothionein synthesis and this could
lead you to move mercury out more slowly. In fact, mercury tends to
accumulate in diabetic cardiomyopathy because of loss of HDAC
inhibition. I posted on this in sci.life-extension if you're interested.
> > + Butyrate (~3g daily).
>
> Would eating psyllium produce similar results?
Only if you have adequate gut bacteria levels. If you have a history of
antibiotic use, this could be a problem. Gut flora also decline with
age.
>
> > + Green tea extract
>
> Not sure, but tea seems to reduce my sciatica.
GTE is also raises the pain threshold via PPARalpha agonism.
> > + Atrial natriuretic factor (produced via certain types of heat
> > stress).
>
> Would hot showers work?
No. But it would probably induce other heat shock protective factors.
> > ....check for metals poisoning and other toxicities.
>
> I had my mercury amalgams removed now almost 20 years ago. Not sure if
> that was a factor.
It can stay in bones and fat a long time. Since diabetics also have low
molybdenum levels, this affects metallothionein synthesis and this could
lead you to move mercury out more slowly. In fact, mercury tends to
accumulate in diabetic cardiomyopathy because of loss of HDAC
inhibition. I posted on this in sci.life-extension if you're interested.
> > + Butyrate (~3g daily).
>
> Would eating psyllium produce similar results?
Only if you have adequate gut bacteria levels. If you have a history of
antibiotic use, this could be a problem. Gut flora also decline with
age.
>
> > + Green tea extract
>
> Not sure, but tea seems to reduce my sciatica.
GTE is also raises the pain threshold via PPARalpha agonism.
> > + Atrial natriuretic factor (produced via certain types of heat
> > stress).
>
> Would hot showers work?
No. But it would probably induce other heat shock protective factors.
Re: Supplements for Neuropathy
jay wrote:
> What supplements provide relief from polyneuropathy? Would the
> following be the most important? Already doing paleo-type diet,
> moderate exercise and multi-vitamins.
>
> Benfotiamine
> Vitamin B6 (P-5-P)
> R-Lipoic Acid
> NAC
> Acetyl-L-Carnitine
Here's my list links to info on polyneuropathy treatment employing
supplements and blood sugar control: All have been very helpful.
http :// www .medscape,com /viewarticle/565795 1
http :// www .ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8886748?dopt«stract
http :// www .diabetesincontrol,com /results.php?storyarticleW02
http :// www .tga.gov.au/adr/aadrb/aadr0504.htm
http :// www .ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16609090
http :// www .diabeteshealth,com /read/2008/04/23/5161.html
http :// www .diabetic-talk.org/dpn.htm
http :// diabetesmonitor,com /m57.htm
http :// www .benfotiamine.org/FAQ.htm#faq10
http :// dcf.evms.edu/research/nutrinerve.html
http :// www .neuroeffex,com /
http :// www .dlife,com /dLife/do/ShowContent/inspiration expert advice/expert columns/chous oct2006.html
http :// www .dlife,com /dLife/do/ShowContent/inspiration expert advice/expert columns/chous 012808.html
jay wrote:
> What supplements provide relief from polyneuropathy? Would the
> following be the most important? Already doing paleo-type diet,
> moderate exercise and multi-vitamins.
>
> Benfotiamine
> Vitamin B6 (P-5-P)
> R-Lipoic Acid
> NAC
> Acetyl-L-Carnitine
Here's my list links to info on polyneuropathy treatment employing
supplements and blood sugar control: All have been very helpful.
http :// www .medscape,com /viewarticle/565795 1
http :// www .ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8886748?dopt«stract
http :// www .diabetesincontrol,com /results.php?storyarticleW02
http :// www .tga.gov.au/adr/aadrb/aadr0504.htm
http :// www .ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16609090
http :// www .diabeteshealth,com /read/2008/04/23/5161.html
http :// www .diabetic-talk.org/dpn.htm
http :// diabetesmonitor,com /m57.htm
http :// www .benfotiamine.org/FAQ.htm#faq10
http :// dcf.evms.edu/research/nutrinerve.html
http :// www .neuroeffex,com /
http :// www .dlife,com /dLife/do/ShowContent/inspiration expert advice/expert columns/chous oct2006.html
http :// www .dlife,com /dLife/do/ShowContent/inspiration expert advice/expert columns/chous 012808.html
